Marmoratus morphs: terrestrial or aquatic?

[Molch]

I could use some advice with my marm morphs:

they have gotten their beautiful green colors and the larval characteristics have all but disappeared, although they still have some gill remnants. They are 6-7 cm and basically look very good.

Tank temp is 60 F

I was going to see them through metamorphosis according to Jennewt's method from this thread. I have an island with cover for them, and a separate terrestrial setup ready for those who climb up on the island and look like they would like to sample land life.

Whenever I find a morph on the island I run off excitedly and get the terrestrial setup, check the moss and moisture, add bugs - and when I go to fetch the newt from his island, he's back in the water hunting blackworms or hanging out on the hornwort at the surface.

so...do they not want to become terrestrial? Is this in-and-out business what other people get? Should I just grab them when they are on the island and put them in the terretstrial setup? What should Mama do?


p.s: would post pics, but connection is too slow right now - however, they look just like Jen's in her thread that I linked above

[Mark]

If they've still got gill stubs perhaps they aren't quite ready. It's normal for them to dip in and out of the water during this stage and especially whilst there's food underwater.

Make sure they have a little hide on the island. If they feel insecure their instinct is to dive for the water. When they start spending the majority of their time on land I normally pop them in a terrestrial tub (even if they dive back in I net them out).

Most importantly, don't worry about them! Marm juveniles are bullet proof eating machines, whether they're aquatic or terrestrial. Whatever they do they'll be fine.

[Molch]

thanks Mark :)
Meanwhile, I got my first two fully morphed land newts. I transfered them to a woodland setup in an exoterra box, seeded with lots of whiteworms, field plankton and isos.

Here's a couple shots: btw, isn't it amazing how well camouflaged they are in the moss? This moss has the same green fronts with the reddish middle vein, just like the marms..

[Jeroen Spobeck]

Larvae:


Juvs:


Adults:

[FrogEyes]

As a point of comparison, I would note that some populations of Taricha are almost entirely aquatic in the wild, and the same is true of some Notophthalmus. Many N.viridescens populations lack an eft stage as well.

[Chris Michaels]

I assume you mean Triturus, not Taricha, FrogEyes...?

[FrogEyes]

No. Many more northerly populations of T.granulosa are almost entirely aquatic.

[Chris Michaels]

Ah, I see. The same is true for some Triturus populations, so I thought you were referring to those. My mistake!

[Niels D]

I've always been interested in the differences between raising them aquatic or terrestrial. I've bred N.v.louisianensis, T.marmoratus and H.orientalis in an aquatic setup, with only a large piece of stone sticking out of the (full with Java moss) water offering all the food in the water, in a paper towel setup and in a coco peat setup.

With a little effort I could pincer feed all three species, even Notophthalmus. With this last species the aquatic animals grew a lot faster in the beginning. Now they're adult all animals are of the same size the smallest specimen being raised aquatic and the biggest being raised terrestrial. Having less animals on land than in the water it still took a lot of time feeding the terrestrial juveniles, but I could do it while watching the telly.

With T.marmoratus I hardly saw any difference in size. The animals on land were given small waxies sometimes though. Same goes for H.orientalis, except the wax worms of course. I offered them blood worms on paper towel. Really enjoyed raising them both ways.

For T.marmoratus and N.v.louisianensis I prefer raising them on land with paper towels. Some fellow keepers are a little upset when they see my containers which only contain paper towels and plant pots splitten in two as hiding places. I admit that it looks very unnatural, but most of my juveniles are ferocious eaters and run out of their hiding places towards the pincers when it's feeding time.

[Morg]

I have raised marmoratus both terrestrial with small water bowl, and in a half and half semi aquatic set up with shallow water through my many years of newt keeping.
I found generally that if given a lot of water as an option, young marms will take to the water a lot, and can of their own accord opt to go aquatic just a month after metamorphosis.
These individuals would then have more water added and land area would just be a piece of floating cork bark, which was then rarely used at all no matter what time of the year.

These newts raised this way can reach maturity and even breed in just 1 year.
I have also had the same happen with crested newts