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Still laying eggs...

This is a discussion on Still laying eggs... within the Newt and Salamander Help forums, part of the Beginner Newt, Salamander, Axolotl & Help Topics category; My C. Orientalis is still laying eggs - now upwards of six weeks of doing so. I have 30 larva ...

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Old 2nd May 2009   #1 (permalink)
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Default Still laying eggs...

My C. Orientalis is still laying eggs - now upwards of six weeks of doing so. I have 30 larva in three tanks, separated every 3 weeks or so. I'm really worried about survival during the morphing phase (them and me as I don't take the down side well!) and would like any tips in helping at least them in doing so. I will count eggs tomorrow then donate them - I assume they're safer to ship than any other stage? I know someone here volunteered to take the larva, but I was too worried about them surviving the shipment. I will go back and search if he doesn't see this and remind me!

It seems as though this morphing stage has the least written about it. I feel like I've searched high and low but don't see much information, just that they often do not survive this. If I've missed something in the links or caresheets, please redirect me. I'm expecting white worms shortly and assume that is a decent food along with bloodworms? I need to know the best substrate and if a reptile water dish is the best option. Currently, the tank with the four most mature larva (close to 7 weeks old) has a turtle dock and floating plants, no filter which I don't plan on using until they become aquatic again if they survive. I am very concerned with husbandry and food these next two months in anticipation of the morph.

Will removing the floating plants deter the egg-laying or is she going to lay until she's done laying? I don't want to harm her at all, but the numbers are getting high.

Thanks for any leads/information,
Dana



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Old 2nd May 2009   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

Separating the adult male(s) from the female is the only thing that will deter egg laying, but it may take several weeks to be effective (the female stores sperm).

If your larvae are eating well, the next 1-2 months should be a piece of cake for you. Larvae almost always survive metamorphosis. Rarely, one will drown, but even the sickliest tiny ones will usually survive the actual metamorphosis process. It's the weeks/months thereafter when problems ensue. It's great that you have whiteworms going. You might also want to look into flightless fruit flies and pinhead crickets.



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Old 2nd May 2009   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

Thank you again for all your help here. Any advice on the substrate and husbandry post morph? I currently have the adult tank going well for 13 mos. now (10 Gal), the four 6-7 week old larva w/ a turtle dock (10 Gal.), and two plastic shoe-box sized containers house the 3 week olds and the newly hatched. I will drill holes into their tops when the time comes, but suppose I will need additional tanks. The boys just broke another 10 Gal. collecting specimens from the yard and carrying the tank around...Grrr! I'm quite lost on substrate. I see someone is selling Java moss here - is that OK? My tree frog is in a vivarium w/ that brick you soak in water for 30 and it greatly expands. We put moss on top. I was considering something similar with a reptile dish for water. Before, I thought I needed more water, but seeing as how so many drown, I will reconsider that option for the one I just described.

Again, I'm grateful for your time,
Dana



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Old 2nd May 2009   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

Oh, one more thing. I had questioned separating the pair but was told once the deed is done, it won't have much impact. Is it uncommon to mate repeatedly or are these eggs still from that initial encounter? I will buy another tank tomorrow and move one of them.

Can the morphs be reunited w/ the parents at some point or is that dangerous to them? I'm really concerned about enough tanks!

Dana



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Old 2nd May 2009   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

Six weeks is nothing.....try 9 months laying eggs!!
I think it requires several matings for a female to lay that long, but im not sure...i guess they can lay for a long period with a single mating too.



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Old 2nd May 2009   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

OK, so I will separate them today - maybe I'll turn our bathtubs into newt habitats! I could have sworn I put this question out there before and a separation didn't seem like it would influence too much. Oh well, what's done is done...

Thanks for all the advice - can you direct towards info on husbandry during morphing?

Dana



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Old 4th May 2009   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

I don't remember now where I had seen it, but I remember having seen around here somewhere, where a lady had taken one of those plastic aquariums with the snap-on ventilated tops and used that for the morphs. She used paper towels if I remembered correctly, and kept them damp. Then she used a small food/water dish that is textured for our little friends to easily get in and out of and used that for water, taking care to use very little so they don't drown. She used a credit card to hang over part of it so that they would have another way to get out. There was moss around the dish. She used mostly moss for them to hide in and built it up in an "island" for them. She did some other things too, so if you look in the morphs and food/husbandry area I think you will find it. She fed them flightless fruit flies, and that may have been the origin of the thread. The white worms would also be good too I would suppose. I really don't know. She had to do something with the ventilation holes so the flies did not walk right out, but the morphs could get air. I think she might have lightly covered the top with paper towel.

Hope this helps,
Critter Mom



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Old 4th May 2009   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs.../Critter Mom

I don't know of the site where morphs are discussed along with husbandry. I've searched here, but maybe I'm just missing it?

Thanks for the above information. If you have the link or can tell me what to click on, I'd appreciate it!

Dana



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Old 4th May 2009   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

I searched Caudata Culture and found this excerpt; The terrestrial juveniles can take 1-3 years to reach sexual maturity. Some keepers prefer to keep the metamoprhs semiaquatic in tanks of very shallow water (1-2 cm; 1 inch) with lots of aquatic plants such as java moss and Elodea as this tends to speed up growth rates.

As for food, mine are started out on white worms, springtails, and fruit flies occasionally.

Hopefully that helps you out a little or at least gets you going in the right direction.



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Old 5th May 2009   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

Thanks, Justin. That does help. I'm waiting on the white worms now - will try to keep them going using your earlier advice afterwards. I guess you just dump them into the water? If the newts are post-morph, do you feed them in a dish on land?

Thanks,
Dana



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Old 5th May 2009   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

That is correct. just dump them in!

Although I myself, suggest rinsing the worms in a bit of bottled spring water first, then squirting them into the tank with an eyedropper or turkey baster. Those squeeze bulbs they sell for cleaning out infant's noses work really well too!

One thing to keep in mind though, is that a few hours after feeding, it is wise to suck out and discard any uneaten food and feces to prevent your water chemistry from crashing.


And here is a great site with husbandry information:

http://www.caudata.org/cc/species/Cynops/C_orientalis.shtml




Last edited by SludgeMunkey; 5th May 2009 at 14:23. Reason: pasted in wrong link
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Old 6th May 2009   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Still laying eggs...

I thank you again for your words of wisdom! I have seen that particular page on husbandry, but I think I'm looking for more specifics on what to buy for the terrestrial. I have a tree frog who is housed on a brick substance that grows immensely with water and looks like bark or mulch, sort of. I top it w/ some green mossy looking stuff - all purchased at the pet store and discarded almost weekly. He's in a big vivarium, so I don't clean it out religiously but change his water almost daily. He can swim in this shallow reptile bowl that resembles the one in the picture of the person asking about her salamander vivarium. Anyway, I guess I'm unsure as to what to create the "land" with for the morphs. My adults had the swoop of gravel that I have since learned is not the best due to pockets of bacteria, so I switched to at turtle dock that floats. They never use it as far as I know. Once the parents returned to the water after a long terrestrial phase in the months following our purchase of them, I never see them on land.

Thanks,
Dana



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