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Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

This is a discussion on Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish. within the Axolotl General Discussion forums, part of the Axolotls (Ambystoma mexicanum) category; So I'm new in Caudata, but I've done extensive research and a lot of aquarium keeping comes by just instinct ...

Axolotl General Discussion Open axolotl forum: if it doesn't fit in the sub-topics then post it here.

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  • 3 Post By auntiejude
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #1 (permalink)
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Post Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

So I'm new in Caudata, but I've done extensive research and a lot of aquarium keeping comes by just instinct and intuition. I'm a first time Axolotl owner, unsure of the sex, but leaning towards it being a Male wild type, I've heard that Axolotl are notoriously difficult to keep with anything other than another axie; well I took it upon myself after having "Toothless" for several months and housing him with several dozen ghostshrimp as well as whitecloud minnows, both to act as alternate food stuffs and added life to the tank, that I would try something a little risky as well as unorthodox. As of about a week I purchased two very social and happy Rope/Reedfish to house with Toothless, I've read in one single post that in theory with enough room that it could be possible, but I wanted to put this theory into action, the tank rests at a steady 22/23 Celsius which is on the lower end for the ropefish, but still warm/cool enough for the two ranges to be happy. I keep toothless well fed on black worms as well as what's available, he's currently 7in or so and the two ropefish range from 8 to 9in long, and so far they are getting along great, one seemed to take a liking to toothless almost immediately and was very intrigued by this new tank mate and at night they alternate resting around one another but the ropefish always end up back around eachother. I just wanted to make an actual post of this topic for anyone else who may be curious on the prospect of housing the two species together or follow there progress.
Note- currently well planted 20 gallon tank soon to be upping tank size, 2 whisper 10 filters, and very well oxigenated water due to several airstones which both species seem very fond of. Also has large custom made sandstone structure/hide, cholla wood, freshwater clam shells and sand for substrate.



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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

22-23C is too warm for an axie, too cold for tropical fish.
The fish WILL at some point see your axie's gill as tasty snacks.
Your axie WILL at some point try and eat the fish.
There is a reason why axies are species only - listen to the wisdom of the thousands of owners and separate them.



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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

As AuntieJude says above NEVER EVER EVER keep any other species of fish with an Axolotl EVER, if the axie one day decides, hmmm, I am bit hungrier than usual, it might eat the other fish, and possibly cause issues, or the fish decide, hmmm,I'm hungrier than usual, the fish will take to eating the fluffy part of the Axolotls gills, and that is no good.

On top of that the Axolotl must be kept in water between 10 and 20 degrees Celsius (58-68 degrees Fahrenheit) anything above that for a long period of time will stress the Axolotl (even one degree above) and will make him/her more susceptible to catching illness and disease, which is a very stressful to the axolotl (and yourself), on top of that most illnesses Axolotls can catch are fatal if not caught right away or treated correctly.

So please, please, please for the sake of your Axolotl remove the other fish and get the tank to the correct temperature.



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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

I respectfully disagree with Eternie and AuntieJude. If you are cautious and extensive in your understanding of the fish in question and the axolotl then No isn't always the only answer. I keep white cloud mountain minnows with my axolotl and they don't mind each other and seem to enjoy the company. Why did I do this? Because I can keep tank temps in perfect axolotl conditions and have the WCMM be good too, if the axolotl did eat them then they had no defensive spines or way of harming him and were thoroughly quarantined previously anyway, they are not known to nip or try at his gills, and the WCMM add to the life of the tank. I did extensive research before trying this and was very cautious when doing so and had back up tanks and plans ready. This doesn't mean any fish can be with axolotls cause they can't, defensive spines, parasites, different temp ranges, gill nipping, and many factors need to be questioned on detail first. The temps you listed are a bit high though buddy. But I continue to prove many people on here wrong about never being able to put fish with axolotls every day. Not to say this is a constant for every axolotl or every tank, just with mine. Sorry for the long post...



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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

Thank you for the responses everyone so far. The fish I do get come from a very clean and reputable store and I still maintain the quarantine period before adding and thing plant or animal. Everything I've read on axolotl temp ranges says not to exceed 24c which my room temp is a steady 22-23 but I can get it colder with my aquarium fan, but iv read the upper ranges help to keep appetite and metabolism up and healthy, while I know not necessary for an axolotl I think is nice to see the increase activity and allows me to readily interact with him and everyone knows despite being amphibians axies can be quite friendly and full of personality which is exactly why in this situation I made the decision to put two very social and friendly rope fish in with Toothless. I keep my tank well planted and stocked with white cloud minnows and several dozen ghost shrimp at any given time to distract both toothless and the rope fish so they can naturally be the predatory fish they are but on top of that they're is a regular feeding of blackworms and frozen blood worms which both enjoy. Like everyone says and I will admit this, housing axies with anything is a really bad idea lol its even exceptionally hard to do with another axolotl if you don't have sufficient space, but that is manageable. Trust me if it were any other set of animals or attiudes/demeanor I wouldn't have done this, I know it usually ends terribly for animals as well as the owner. I constantly keep an eye out for signs of stress or agressive behavior and honestly they just seem to like socializing and interacting with eachother, I've never heard or read and haven't observed gill nipping from white clouds or ropefish. Honestly I think this setup can work longterm for both species. I will be upping the tank size very soon to 50gal lowboy breeder tank so to lessen stress for both sets of animals. I know that there's no "special" circumstances and I'm going to get a lot of flack for this, but I will be posting pictures soon. :)



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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

Oh my goodness, I am not trying to be rude, but if you do good extensive research you will find any fish WILL mistake the axolotls gills for a snack, whether they are or are not aggressive, AND axolotls DO eat fish, they DO originate from a lake so they DO eat fish. You are just harming your axolotls, and thats the fact, disagree all you want. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE remove the fish from the Axolotls tank, you are just putting the axolotl at risk, and if you dont, some day you will realize the error in not doing so. Do whatever you want at this point, just know, keeping your axolotl with other animals is causing a great risk to your axolotl, there is a reason why they are a species only animal, and I absolutely CRINGE at the fact that you are risking the axolotls life, Any breeder, and reputable source will tell you TO NEVER put fish with axolotls. Please take this into consideration for both of your alls axolotls safety.

Please keep in mind,I am really am not trying to be rude, I am just very concerned for the Axolotl safety and health. In other words, if you need anything pertaining to the axolotl, dont hesitate to contact me. Though as I've already said, please please please consider removing the fish from the axolotl, or just move the fish over to the new aquarium and start a fish only aquarium, and you can get some pretty cool fish that way such as parrot fish.



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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

Eternie I thank you very much for the concern and I don't think you rude what so ever, in fact more gracious in your responses than I would've expected, so I thank you for being so mild in this regard. I will definitely consider what you're saying; I hold the upmost concern when it comes to Toothless's wellbeing as well as the rope fish and minnows, but this is while not advised or necessarily wise, a short term experiment to see the interactions between these two species. With both being predators with ample food, and space as well as social and bordering playful tendencies I want to see how far it will play out since there's so little data on interactions between these two species, and hopefully if it doesn't work it will warn against anyone else wishing to try, or if it does work then perhaps Warren another look at there social interactions for other enthusiasts. Thank you again for the concern, I am although it doesn't seem like equally concerned, but I wouldn't be doing this if I didn't see promise in it, I wouldn't put their wellbeing to the side for the sake of curiosity if it seemed at all detrimental to them. I know white clouds do not nipping gills, they're likely the most neutral fish possible, and rope fish will only eat what will fit in their mouth much like an axie and they seem to be completely uninterested in his gills. Both species also have a similar growth rate and lifespan which is another factor that I took into account, so by the time toothless is full grown the rope fish will be unable to fit into his mouth and vice versa, and with ample live food and territory it seems very promising. Thank you very much for the concern and info I cannot tell you how much I appreciate it, but with how social and friendly both sets of these animals are, I have a feeling this could be a plausible combination that works. Again I cannot thank you enough for your advice on this matter and will definitely message you if any concerns arise



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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

Thank you Turtledrew15 for the support, I will admit the temp is on the extremes for both but I recall reading somewhere some Australian axie owners keeping them at near or above 26c longterm and them doing fine, but I am even uncomfortable with that and believe that to be waaaayyy to high, but thank you for your support none the less; however Toothless does in fact view his WCMM tank mates as food and eats one from time to time lol but I've never seen nipping from them and the don't bottom dwell like axies do so I'm not too concerned, the hunt is good for him and will be just as necessary for the ropes unless they stick to the shrimp and blackworms.



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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

I don't think eternie was being rude and this is a place for conversation so all views are welcome. But it just is not true that it is unavoidable and your axolotl 100% WILL eat the fish as if it is a fact that will never be not true. I have not had a single fish loss and my axies gills are healthy and full all the time. Eternie makes it seem as if fish WILL ALWAYS nip at gills or that axie will DEFINITELY 100% eat fish. This is not true. Does it vary? Yes. Is every axolotl the same? No. I have done extensive research whether others agree or not. Just because axolotls originated from a lake and ate fish naturally does not mean your captive bred axolotl is the exact same and absolutely just cannot be with fish. That is an assumption. In my specific case, I have had success and no poor results. Fish and axolotl are healthy with no apparent stress or damage to either party. Maybe eternie axolotl cannot have this, I cannot say. But my point is, don't be afraid to try new things as long as you know what your doing, the potential possibilities, and are always keeping in mind the health and safety of all tank inhabitants.



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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

I forgot to say, in this specific situation I do not personally believe it is a great choice to have ropefish with axolotl just for the potential of competition, fights, and stress. But if you think you can prove me wrong and have a successful tank, then by all means. Just please keep in mind the safety of all the inhabitants and what is best for them as eternie mentions. It is something to be taken into extreme caution and consideration. I did what I did because I study and practice marine biology and work in labs and used all the tools at my disposal to come to a decision where i felt very sure and safe. It worked for me and I prove all those "reputable sources" wrong every day haha. Science is amazing and there are all kinds of things that people say are matter of fact that are more flexible than believed to be. But PLEASE be careful and VERY certain of any decision you make and have close monitoring, if anything goes south have a tank ready to move something to for worst case scenario. But good luck in life and any decision you make!



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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

[B]I am not going to comment on the fish as i tend to agree with the NO no part and down the road will have concequences! . but 22 degress is too warm for your axo! We are not trying to put you down but you did say you are new to this....they will be still active at 16-19C I dont know what you think lower temps will make them eat less..omg they are piggys that young! you may not notice VISIBLe stress its more of a internal thing as well as your going to have more cases of disease and fungus..as well ...please put a fan on your tank and dont ever let it go about 21 max...i flick mine on at 20! [I dont kknow why you need to prove everyone wrong on housing fish who need higher tems with a cool water axolotl...both animals are at risk..with the experiment..if you need fish so bad then get a seperate fish tank and enjoy the rope fish on thier own! its whats best for both speciaes to have the correct peramiters.../B]



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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #12 (permalink)
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Thumbs down Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

Woah boy, there's a lot to unpack here. I acknowledge your love for Toothless and that's great! No one wants to hurt their pet on purpose though, so I have a few suggestions:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cazhalsey View Post
Everything I've read on axolotl temp ranges says not to exceed 24c which my room temp is a steady 22-23 but I can get it colder with my aquarium fan
Axolotls come from the snow-capped mountain lakes around Mexico City. Most people think of hot deserts or tropical beaches when they think of Mexico, but this area of the country is temperate, with snowy winters and cooler summers. You should definitely try to keep the tank below 20C. I've found the optimal range to be between 15C and 18C, as this realistically mimics their natural habitat. It's also stressful for any Axolotl to live in warmer water (21C or higher), you will notice a significantly decreased life span, and greater susceptibility to disease if continued.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cazhalsey View Post
iv read the upper ranges help to keep appetite and metabolism up and healthy, I keep my tank well planted and stocked with white cloud minnows and several dozen ghost shrimp at any given time to distract both toothless and the rope fish so they can naturally be the predatory fish
It's true that warmer water will speed up an Axolotl's metabolism and activity, although it might not be healthy for them in the long run. I try and keep my tank around 15-18C and my Axolotls are super active. I find that individual personality often weighs in more with how an Axolotl behaves and swims around. Your Axolotls will definitely eat the minnows once they are big enough. They will also eat the shrimp. Both are okay as long as you can be sure your tank is without fungi and parasites. It's very easy to introduce these to a healthy tank by restocking it and not quarantining animals for at least a couple weeks. You acknowledge here that Axolotls and Ropefish and both predatory by nature. Your Axies and Ropefish will most definitely nip at each other. Its just their nature to, but it's not good for either animal and will cause more stress to both. Ropefish are from the rivers of the Congo, right in the middle of a tropical rain forest. These animals could not have more different housing specifications!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cazhalsey View Post
Like everyone says and I will admit this, housing axies with anything is a really bad idea lol
Yes!! Please don't think that nothing bad will ever happen to your axies, that's exactly what everyone thinks: "Oh, it'll never happen to me." I'm not saying that you aren't knowledgeable or loving, but so many things could go wrong so quickly with this tank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cazhalsey View Post
I recall reading somewhere some Australian axie owners keeping them at near or above 26c longterm and them doing fine.
Y'all Aussies need to research if this is true! Water in an axolotls habitat seldom rises above 65F/18.5C. That's over a 13 degree difference in Fahrenheit!

Also, I'm interested, what's your setup like/water parameters/tank size? I know you love your pet, but it's not going to make up for bad husbandry.



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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Axolotl housed with Ropefish/Reedfish.

I almost want to think this is a troll...



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