Recovering from some bad advice.

[jamontoast]

Greetings chaps, and chapettes. Absolutely new here and looking for somewhat of a hand.

I have recently come into posession of 2 shiny, new axolotls, one effectively black wild type [named Jeff] and an albino [named Werner Herzog], and have had rather a lot of issues.

To start with, upon purchasing, I was assured by the fellow in the aquarium I visited that the 20L tank he sold me would be large enough for my two 'lotls, and that all I would need to do was drop 5 or 6 sinking pellets in every couple of days. He sold me a small sponge filter, as well as an admittedlty very nice low light plant grown into a porus rock. Never mentioned anything about cycling, or measures of water quality, nor anything pertaining to cleaning.

Needless to say, I was off to a bad start.

After some general internet perursal over the following days, I found my setup to be woefully inadequite and horribly cared for. I promptly found them a 50 litre tank, and moved them over. Still uncycled, but surely the larger tank was better. I transferred over all of the tank contents and began a regime of cleaning with a turkey baster, feeding frozen bloodworm cubes as well as pellets, by hand with long plastic tweezers, and water changes. This is currently where I am at. The tank temperature drops to around 15C at night and may be as high as 17.5C during the day, and the chemical readings are all over the shop. Some days, all will read high and I freak out and change large volumes of water [dechlorinating and chilling it to tank temperature first], other days, they will be reasonable. I am unable to discern a pattern.

Regardless, today I am picking up a 36"x15"x15" tank, which I'm certain is large enough, and I want to get it right.

What size and type of filter, would anyone reccomend? Substrate? [they're currently on bare-*** glass]. Is the temperature fluctuation too great for comfort/'lotl health? and which of the many arcane methods for getting a tank cycled quickly seems to work for people, if any?

Sorry about the wall of text, but I just want to get everything straight this time.

[Sam]

Firstly welcome and congrats.
A staple diet for axies are earth worms, they are the best thing to feed them.
I would stick with your sponge filter since axies don't like to much water movement.
How big are your axies you could keep them in the tank they are in now and cycle the one your geting soon.
For substrate I recomend sand or as you have now bare bottum, you could also use slate as a substrate but know gravel as axies can swallow it and get inpacted and that can lead up to death.
I don't think these temperture changes are good for your axie try and keep the diference in day and night tempeture to a minimum.
I find the quickist way to cycle a tank is to run a filter in a mature tank for a few weeks and then put it in the new tank with a sorce of amnomnia.
hope ive helped, if you have any more questions feel free to ask,
Sam
P.S If you want to add reputation click on the skales and add positive *HINT*
"cough cough add cough to cough my rep cough reputation"

[jamontoast]

Earthworms. Noted. I have a ladyfriend with a worm farm, so this may end happily [cheaply] for me.

I worry about the sponge filter, as it is really very small. Sold to me for use in a 20L tank, going into what i have just figured to be a ~120L tank. Would a cannister, or some such be a better option? or simply a larger sponge? presumably I would have to be running a filter to get the new tank cycled anyway, so I figure buying something new is unavoidable.

Sand seems the best option at the moment, as I have absolutely no idea where i would get slate, let alone get slate cut to the correct dimensions.

The temperature changes will presumably be minimised upon changing to the larger tank, simply due to volume, but until then if they are highly detrimental, any ideas on a method of [strangely] keeping the tank from cooling too much?

Any methods to haste cycling that don't involve a mature tank [which I lack]?

To answer your question, they are both around 6inches long, though little Werner is likely closer to 7.

and oh of course I will bump your reputation :P

[Sam]

You could use a internal power filter but remember axies don't like fast moving water.
Probably the best way to cycle your tank without a mature tank is to run your sponge filter with what ever new filter you get (remember nothing to strong or use a spray bar)
in the new tank witha sorce of amnomnia e.g fish flakes or a small fish like a guppy.
It sounds like you have a plan for where you are going to get your worms.
I do apreasheate you adding to my rep
Remember if you have any more questions feel free to ask,
Sam

[Dolores]

I also use an internal filter and yes they don't like fast moving water. So if you want an internal filter make sure you can find one where you can change the (how do you say that....) amount of... current with a knob... thingy...



*Searching*
This is a filter that has the same thing on it... and a tube thingy...

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Morrison

I also use an internal filter and yes they don't like fast moving water. So if you want an internal filter make sure you can find one where you can change the (how do you say that....) amount of... current with a knob... thingy...



*Searching*
This is a filter that has the same thing on it... and a tube thingy...

Do you meen flow Morrison

[Carson]

Only thing I have a disagreement about with sponge filters, and those internal filters is the terrible mechanical filtration they have. I run a canister filter in my 40 gallon tank, and it does a fair job. I have a flow diverter in my tank to make sure the flow isn't too strong for the axolotls. although canister filters can get pricey, and are definatly not necessary. so long as the tank is cycled and the parameters are fine there is no need for heavy filtration. If you're worried about filtration levels, some people even go filterless in their tanks with a little airstone to prevent stagnant water. I don't think I could do that, because I like a clean tank, but as long as the parameters are fine, theres no need to worry.

[Mojo]

Not much to add on the filter side of things, as I just bought what was recommended by my local aqua / rep store, since the assistant there had kept axies before.
You don't HAVE to put anything on the floor of the tank - some people prefer to have a bare floor If adding sand, make sure it is the correct sort - reptile sand is no good. Neither is some sorts of aquarium sand. The cheapest option is play sand for kids, but it needs a LOT of rinsing before adding to a tank *the general advise it to rinse, rinse some more + keep rinsing, then when your arms are ready to drop off + you're beginning to really hate sand, rinse it a few more times, LoL!)
Make sure your axies have got a minimum of 1 hiding place each (preferably more), as this helps to keep them happy
Then, what I noticed from your post is that you feed frozen bloodworm with tweezers / tongs... I assume this is while still frozen, as I can't see how it would be possible otherwise. Apologies if I'm wrong, but I felt it imporaant to add that frozen food should alwats be thawed before feeding (though as previously mentioned, earthworms are the best staple diet - if your axies are too small, or don't take well to the change in diet, chop the worms up into bite size pieces, but soak them in clean water before offering them, as they secrete a nasty taste when cut - keep persevering though, because they'll thank you for it in the long run. Pellets + bloodworm are good for an occasional change)

[mewsie]

I just love that you have 'happy-'lotl' as one of your tags!

[Boo Penguin]

Hey

Congrats on your lotls

Its always good to see Aussies on here.

It seems like once again the pet shop people are wrong. This happens all the time sadly.

You seem to be going great so far though, it shouldn't be too much of an issue to cycle your tank with the axi's in. I did this for mine and she was just fine and dandy. As for the cooling I wouldn't worry too much; axi's can survive very chilled temps. Some are even kept in outdoor ponds which ice over in the winter. Chilling right now is not an issue... it will be our blasted summer that becomes a problem.

Just out of interest where did you get your tank from? I've been looking for a new one for a while but all the big ones are majorly expensive... and really too tall for a lotl

[jamontoast]

Thanks so much for all the responses, fellows.

Based on what you guys have said, I've decided that i'll likely keep on at it, with my small sponge filter, and add an airstone to the other end of the new tank for some nice symmetry, added oxygenation, etc. I do this due to potential flow issues, the benifits of using a sponge that has some possible chance of having a small bacterial colony living in it, and the prohibitative price of any larger filters.

Mojo, thanks for noting my casual mention of feeding them frozen food, and setting me straight. Shall not be doing this from now on, and didn't realise that there was a problem with doing it. And as per your advice, i'll certainly be throwing in some hides once i have the new tank up and going.

Boo Penguin, with the :3 avatar, you have calmed me about the temperature situation. This will improve further with the new tank; more water, less likelihood of big temperature swings. The new tank has a fixed glass plate in the centre; thinking of mounting a fan facing either way for a little help cooling during the summer. Would the presence of the filter bubbles at one end and an airstone at the other aid this?

As for tanks, apart from the first one which i bought new for 50 dollars, i have been buying second hand. The tank my amphibious darlings are in at the moment was 20 dollars from the salvation army and is holding about 40L. The new tank, which i got via online classifieds, cost me 50 dollars for 120L (3ft tank), however it was very, very far from clean. I had to remove large ammounts of old gravel, dirt and water, scrub every part of it and it seems to have still retained a smell, so now it is brimmed with pino-clean overnight, getting ready for tomorrow's scrubbing and rinsing redux. Cheaper than new, and hopefully will be fine, but whether it's worth all the extensive cleaning effort is up to you.

PHOTOS!

Tank 1: woefully tiny



Tank 2: the retankening, also, doing it.



[filter is up way high in this pic. has since been reduced to reduce water flow]



Tank 3: getting ready thanks to the power of green

[Adin]

Never trust the guy or gal at the pet store! They hardly ever have good advice.

[Carson]

Hey if pino-clean is what I think it is, it's not safe for axolotls. Water, vinegar and a 1:10 bleach solutoin is ok for tank cleaning

[Sam]

Glad to see you have sorted out your axies a proper home.
If you have any more questions feel free to ask.
Please could you um Bump my rep now please,
Sam