Two Melanoids & A Wildtype | My First Axies

[Cam]

I picked up my first three axies from a craigslist ad on Monday. After a bit of haggling I got my three axolotls, 2 melanoid 1 wildtype, ~3 inch juveniles, for a total of $35

I've had a 10 gallon tank set up with water, plants, hides, and a sponge filter for a couple of weeks now. I cut up a plastic lid from a sterilite tub, drilled holes in the pieces, and used them as tank dividers.

Now I have all 3 juvenile axies in this 10-gallon, which seems kinda small to me, but I was told they can get stressed if you put them in a big area as juveniles. I also have a ~45 gallon tank with plants, hides, drift wood, & a sponge filter setup and standing by for when they are bigger.

The guy who sold them to me said it would be safe-ish to put them back together at around 5-6 inches. Does that sound accurate?

I'm going to name them when I can tell their genders, but for now they are Mel1, Mel2, and WildT.

This is Mel1, as you can see it is missing both left feet, but they appear to be regenerating and in good health. This is also my hungriest axie :P Monday night I brought them home and Mel1 immediately ate two medium lobster roaches from forceps. Mel1 then ate another small lobster roach the following (Tuesday) morning.


This is WildT. When I got home with them Monday night, I offered WildT a roach. It bit onto the roach, but then spit it out and ignored it. So far I haven't managed to get WildT to eat.






Here's Mel1 & WildT contemplating how delicious each other's legs are on the other side of the barrier.


This is Mel2, I love love love its gills! Mel2 ate 1 roach Monday night when we got home, and then another yesterday (Tuesday) morning.






And here is the tank they currently reside in




Tell me what I'm doing wrong if you notice anything that should be different!! Thanks

[TheAxolotlWhisperer]

Just to start everyone has their own way of doing things so what I say may be totally different than what others think.

Not all juveniles will bite each other. If you have a large enough tank and feed them often enough they wont bite each other, but you should always be prepared to separate them. The 10 gallon seems a little cramped. I don't believe they will be stressed in a bigger tank. Most people will keep them in smaller containers because then you don't need as much space to seperate them all, you can keep a closer eye on them, and water changes are easier. If you'd feel comfortable you could do a trial run and see if it works, but if you notice them biting then separate them. You may find you only have one aggressor as well do you could keep one in the 10g instead of three.

Also I wouldnt feed them roaches because of their shell and they probably don't have much nutrients. I would feed them bloodworms, chopped up or small enough earthworms, and pellets.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Bdyoung

Just to start everyone has their own way of doing things so what I say may be totally different than what others think.

Not all juveniles will bite each other. If you have a large enough tank and feed them often enough they wont bite each other, but you should always be prepared to separate them. The 10 gallon seems a little cramped. I don't believe they will be stressed in a bigger tank. Most people will keep them in smaller containers because then you don't need as much space to seperate them all, you can keep a closer eye on them, and water changes are easier. If you'd feel comfortable you could do a trial run and see if it works, but if you notice them biting then separate them. You may find you only have one aggressor as well do you could keep one in the 10g instead of three.

Also I wouldnt feed them roaches because of their shell and they probably don't have much nutrients. I would feed them bloodworms, chopped up or small enough earthworms, and pellets.

Thanks, I think I will see how they like the 45 gallon tank. I felt like the 10 gallon was pretty cramped, too. I also have pellets and nightcrawlers to cut up for them. I'll have to buy some blood worms.

[Jacob Bidinger]

Originally Posted by Bdyoung

Just to start everyone has their own way of doing things so what I say may be totally different than what others think.

Not all juveniles will bite each other. If you have a large enough tank and feed them often enough they wont bite each other, but you should always be prepared to separate them. The 10 gallon seems a little cramped. I don't believe they will be stressed in a bigger tank. Most people will keep them in smaller containers because then you don't need as much space to seperate them all, you can keep a closer eye on them, and water changes are easier. If you'd feel comfortable you could do a trial run and see if it works, but if you notice them biting then separate them. You may find you only have one aggressor as well do you could keep one in the 10g instead of three.

Also I wouldnt feed them roaches because of their shell and they probably don't have much nutrients. I would feed them bloodworms, chopped up or small enough earthworms, and pellets.

I have to disagree.

10 gallons is more than enough room for a few axolotls, even sub-adults. While they may not be stressed in a bigger tank, it can be difficult for them to locate the food.

Usually axolotls don't bite as a means to take out agression on their neighbors. It is a perfectly normal feeding response for any salamander going through a growth spurt. Even if 2 are in a 125 gallon tank there is still a chance that they will cross paths and possibly get a bite, it's not likely but it is possible.

Last time I checked roaches were a great food. It's true that some species have a hard to digest exoskeleton, but common feeder species like Shelfordella (Blatta) lateralis are relatively soft bodied and full of nutrients. See this link for nutritional analysis: Feeder Insect Analysis Please don't make judgements about a feeder insect that you don't seem to have much experience with.

All that I'm saying is give roaches a chance.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Jake

10 gallons is more than enough room for a few axolotls, even sub-adults.

That's what I had come to understand, too. So you think the accomodations currently look sufficient? Thanks for your point of view :) I'd like to hear a few more opinions on this matter. Anyone else care to weigh in?

Originally Posted by Jake

Last time I checked roaches were a great food. It's true that some species have a hard to digest exoskeleton, but common feeder species like Shelfordella (Blatta) lateralis are relatively soft bodied and full of nutrients. See this link for nutritional analysis: Feeder Insect Analysis Please don't make judgements about a feeder insect that you don't seem to have much experience with.

So you think it's acceptable to feed them roaches as a staple? I thought it would be, since that's the staple for my tiger salamanders, which we all (should) know is the closest relative to the axolotl. My tigers are very healthy & active and beg for their roaches. They try to eat worms sometimes, but much prefer the roaches.

It was my understanding that roaches were higher in protein and lower in fat than pretty much any other feeder insect commonly available. It seems like if I gut loaded them with some high quality salmon pellets that would be the ideal meal for an axie. Anyone care to share your opinions on that?

I can't understand why the roaches exoskeleton would be a problem.

Originally Posted by National Geographic

"Axolotls are long-lived, surviving up to 15 years on a diet of mollusks, worms, insect larvae, crustaceans, and some fish"
Mexican Axolotls, Mexican Axolotl Pictures, Mexican Axolotl Facts - National Geographic

If they can eat mollusks, crustaceans, and vertebrates surely they are also capable of digesting the exoskeleton of an insect. Right? Or is there something I'm missing? At worst I could just feed them freshly molted roaches, right?

[TheAxolotlWhisperer]

By aggressor I meant one who bites the most. Yes they can be in a 10 gallon I never said that they couldn't. But maintaining the water chemistry would be much easier in the 45 gallon. Also I never said that they would never attack each other. Yes it's a possibility obviously, but it's not 100% fact that they will attack each other every time. I've kept juveniles together that never went after each other and I've kept other s that would. So yes you would want to separate them if they do attack each other.

Also I never said that I was 100% correct about the food. My main concern was exoskeleton I've seen a lot of axolotls getting impacted or problems from exoskeletons. Some are softer than others though. Obviously I was wrong about them.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Bdyoung

By aggressor I meant one who bites the most. Yes they can be in a 10 gallon I never said that they couldn't. But maintaining the water chemistry would be much easier in the 45 gallon. Also I never said that they would never attack each other. Yes it's a possibility obviously, but it's not 100% fact that they will attack each other every time. I've kept juveniles together that never went after each other and I've kept other s that would. So yes you would want to separate them if they do attack each other.

Also I never said that I was 100% correct about the food. My main concern was exoskeleton I've seen a lot of axolotls getting impacted or problems from exoskeletons. Some are softer than others though. Obviously I was wrong about them.

Thanks, I was not trying to insult or attack your opinion. Just trying to understand what's best for the little fellas, and if they can eat roaches as a staple that would be ideal since I have thousands upon thousands in my roach colony :P

[Brandon]

Imo the bigger tank would be just fine if you are forcep feeding. Personally I have had 10 or more 3- 4 inch juvies in a 35 long but I keep food in that particular tank 24/7 and there is plenty of java moss for hides and other pls ya and structures and even my most aggressive gfp leucistic doesn't bother his tankmates ...... But god forbid if there isn't a worm in that tank or its like a canabalistic all you can eat buffet after Sunday church LOL Different axies different people do what works and keeps your critters happy is the best advice I can offer

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2

[Kaysie]

I don't buy into that 'they won't find food in a big tank!' baloney. I mean, they're not housed in 10 gallon tanks in the wild, and at least a few of them manage to survive to adulthood. They're big enough that you can put them in a larger tank and monitor their feeding (unless you're hand-feeding, in which case this isn't an issue at all).

[Cam]

Okay, last night I moved my healthy melanoid & wild type into the 45 gallon. So far so good, haven't noticed any aggressive behavior and everyone has their feet still this morning :P

The other melanoid is in the 10 gallon tank until his feet regrow. Then he'll join the others in the 45.

Thanks for all the help & opinions, folks!

Here's the 45, I think I have enough plants & hides to keep them safe from each other. What do you think?


Thanks to Ed for sending me all of those water plants!

[Pluke]

Nice, Cam. I'm sure they'll be plenty happy in that tank.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Pluke

Nice, Cam. I'm sure they'll be plenty happy in that tank.

Thanks, I certainly hope so :) *fingers crossed*

[TheAxolotlWhisperer]

Everything looks great. You could raise the water all the way if you'd want to, but it's not necessary.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Bdyoung

Everything looks great. You could raise the water all the way if you'd want to, but it's not necessary.

Thanks

I wish I could :P There is a crack in the top back corner that I have not repaired yet. That's as high as I can fill it currently.

[Rodrigo]

Even in very large tanks, they quickly learn to come to the front when they notice vibrations or see people standing in front, to beg for food. If you feed in the same place consistently, they will also know where to go when they smell food.

I don´t know if it may be the picture, but it seems to me that Mel1 has iridophores, which would make it an unnusual wild type (but still part of the spectrum) rather than a melanoid.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Azhael

Even in very large tanks, they quickly learn to come to the front when they notice vibrations or see people standing in front, to beg for food. If you feed in the same place consistently, they will also know where to go when they smell food.

Good to know, so they *are* related to tiger salamanders then :P My tigers display that exact behavior :P

Originally Posted by Azhael

I don´t know if it may be the picture, but it seems to me that Mel1 has iridophores, which would make it an unnusual wild type (but still part of the spectrum) rather than a melanoid.

That's actually just some gunk that was floating around in the tank & settling on the axies as I took the pictures :P Dead plant matter I suppose, because nothing else has been in the tanks to create a mess like that. Good observation, though. I wondered when someone would comment on that, haha

[Rodrigo]

Aaaah, i see, explains the lack of iridescence in the eyes.

All caudates seem to learn to beg rather quickly and some individuals get really crazy, trying to bite the glass and swim through it at the same time ...There´s nothing cutter than a newt standing on two feet trying to get to the food (or you, if you want to romantisize).

You can even train them with a little tap on the glass. If they are hungry they´ll come to the front to see if food monkey has delivered.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by Azhael

Aaaah, i see, explains the lack of iridescens in the eyes.

All caudates seem to learn to beg rather quickly and some individuals get really crazy, trying to bite the glass and swim through it at the same time ...There´s nothing cutter than a newt standing on two feet trying to get to the food (or you, if you want to romantisize).

You can even train them with a little tap on the glass. If they are hungry they´ll come to the front to see if food monkey has delivered.

LMAO! Food Monkey! That's exactly what I am, how funny! I am so going to train my animals with a tap on the glass now (or attempt to)

[Cam]

Took a few more pictures, and I've got a question (probably a dumb one, haha)
WildT:








Mel1 in the 10 gallon




The 45 gallon that houses Mel2 & WildT


I can never get photos of Mel2 because it hides behind the plants right in the middle of the tank most of the time.

Now here's my weird question.

The day after putting the axies in their tank I noticed this weird slime/fuzz stuff on the moss. Coincidentally (riiiight) the slime has appeared directly where WildT hung out after I first dropped them in the 45 gallon tank.





Both axies look healthy and are standing in a nice alert position this morning. Clear eyes, clear skin, healthy gills.

[Kaysie]

Suck it out with a turkey baster. See if it comes back. If he likes to hang out there, it could just be slime coat rubbing off on the plants.