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ADF foot rotting off?

This is a discussion on ADF foot rotting off? within the Pipidae: African Clawed Toads, Surinam Toads & Aquatic Frogs forums, part of the Anura: Frogs & Toads category; Google took me to this when I searched for African dwarf frog regeneration. www​.jstor.org/stable/1565922...

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Old 5th May 2015   #21 (permalink)
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Google took me to this when I searched for African dwarf frog regeneration.
www​.jstor.org/stable/1565922



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Old 5th May 2015   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

Yeah, it looks like a bone growing out



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Old 7th May 2015   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

Wow that was an interesting read (I'm actually taking a class in herpetology in the fall), I was told it wasn't possible for them to grow limbs or anything back but maybe I misunderstood...that would be amazing for him to grow his little foot back! I felt so bad that he didn't have a foot and it was my fault



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Old 7th May 2015   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

I have read that their regenerative ability is greatly reduced to gone after metamorphosis. It does appear to be regenerating, so keep us updated. Very interesting!



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Old 19th May 2015   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

Just thought I'd post another picture, I took this one 2 days ago I think but I think if you compare this one to the last one you can see that the bone is growing more! seems like a lot in just a week so I'm pretty excited :) added bonus of his girlfriend on the left who didn't want her picture taken lol she moved as soon as I picked the camera up
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Old 20th May 2015   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

Of all the Axolotl keepers on this forum why had no one suggested refrigeration? That is a commonly used technique to quall an infection... Basically the cool down doesn't allow the infection to spread or worsen. I think the amputation and cleansing treatments saved the frog, but this was a drastic and deformative way of addressing the issue. Had I been in the same position, the last thing I would have done was probe and remove the sore intrusively... I am not trying to say that the life wasn't saved, and for your courage to cut a half leg off wasn't a hard decision, what I am saying is I am amazed no one suggested this... All the cleansing in conjuction with a refrigerated cool down likely may have saved the foot. In regards to the bone regeneration, it is remarkable, however, bone is bone. Has the frog grown in general size since the amputation? I see no musculature, or skin regrowth... Leading me to think it is the skeletal structure growing, and not a true regeneration... I truly hope for the best and a long and happy life for the frog in question.

Some thoughts...

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Old 20th May 2015   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

I'm very sorry to hear this so much after the fact . Honestly refrigeration seems to come up a lot with axolotls but I thought with dwarf frogs their temperature requirements were much higher and fridging would kill him... When I was looking around for more information about what I could have done wrong to put him in this position the minimum requirement was 70F...

As to the suggestion of "probing the sore" there never really was a sore...I don't even think it was a fungus looking back on it...one day his skin and muscle on the leg started disappearing (the skin seemed to be falling off at first causing me to think it was like a stuck shed on a snake)... I'm not sure I'm explaining this very well but by the time I amputated there was no "fungus" and all skin and muscle on the foot was gone completely, he couldn't use the foot at all and it appeared to be rotting on his body. The bones were turning brown and a few of his toe bones fell off before I really considered amputating (I don't think I took a picture that showed the missing toe bones before amputation)...I figured if anything I was just speeding up the process that would have happened without my supervision or antibiotics...

The frog is about the same body size as he was on the day of amputation (which was almost 2 months ago) and when I started noticing the "bone" growth it was only about 10 days ago, he seems to be full grown (he sings a lot at night, I'm not sure if this is a sign of maturity or anything) but his size is definitely the same as it was a month ago, after the amputation and before any "bone" was noticed.

Edit: he can move the bone, It's hard to tell from the picture or in life since everything about these guys just reminds you that they're dwarves (I need to invest in a magnifying glass) but is it possible there is like a thin layer of skin obscuring whatever else is growing and we're just seeing the white of the bone/new skin? I say this because as the "bone" has been growing it looks almost like there is skin stretching at the corners when the "bone" is stretched out. sorry I'm probably overly hopeful/optimistic but if someone can shoot me down I'd be happy with that too, don't want to have false hope :)




Last edited by allied123; 20th May 2015 at 02:40. Reason: added information
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Old 20th May 2015   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

The biggest problem was the beta's. IMO...

JBear



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Old 20th May 2015   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

I think you acted perfectly appropriately, and saved the life of your frog. Refridgeration seems extremely ill advised for a tropical anuran, and likely to cause more stress than it alleviates. While a lower temp could possibly slow bacterial growth, it would increase growth rates had the infection been Chytrid, I have never seen it advised on any dwarf frog site, and would be extremely hesitant to keep a dwarf frog in anything below 65-68F unless advised to do so by a knowledgable vet. You did extremely well to save the life of the animal, most keepers are not successful once infection has set in.



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Old 29th June 2015   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: ADF foot rotting off?

Just thought I'd post another update kind of for myself to keep track of the progress and in case anyone else was interested in this guy's story. It's been a little over a month since the last picture and not much has changed. I have a feeling this might be all the growth I'll see out of this guy, the bone has gotten longer still but I'm not sure he can really regenerate his joint or anything...the bone is getting more and more skin colored though so that's nice.
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