Axie has been floating upside down for a month!

Velaria

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Hello, please help!

My axie is a very young adult, and he has been afflicted with a gas bubble for over a month now. The poor thing just floats upside down all day and night. He eats well and he seems to have a very good will to get over his problem and live a good life, but I'm just surprised that it the air hasn't been expelled by now.

I'm 100% sure that it's a gas bubble because I can see the air in his stomach. Can anything be done to help him get it out? Would it help if I fed him live earthworms or something? You know, if the earthworm moved around inside him, it might help to mix things up inside his stomach? I don't know, I'm grasping at threads. I feel badly for him. Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!
 
I would try offering a variety of foods.

I have also heard of people "massaging" axies in an attempt to fix Gas Bubble.
I would personally not attempt it myself, but im sure your Vet could help with it.


Rayson? any ideas?
 
Hi Velaria,

I think its safer not to jump to conclusions. Would you be able to post up any photos? How are the water quality and temperature? What is the usual diet? What type of substrate do you use? Have you seen the axie poop?

Actually i don't really understand how you can see the bubble in the stomach unless you did a radiograph or ultrasound. Since its a young adult, i assume it has the adult conformation and pigmentation which would warrant visualisation of the viscera difficult at best.

Please fridge your axie. Fridging alone helps to faciliate passage of any blockage in the alimentary tract. Do not try to massage the axie. They are soft bodied animals with delicate skin. Massage can be more detrimental by causing injuries to the internal organs, can cause herniation/eventration and skin damage as well.

Cheers.
 
Rayson to the rescue! Thank you!

I will be posting photos very soon. The axie has 100% water changes every day, but sometimes I skip a day here and there. Diet: until recently, they were all eating live bloodworms. Bloodworms were diet when he developed the air bubble. But for the last three weeks (approximately), he has been changed to a diet of freeze dried tubifex worms. Substrate=none, poop=yes.

Pigmentation = wildtype, but his stomach is a creamy white color, and yes, I do see air inside it. Imagine this: you have a small plastic ping pong ball that's semi-translucent. The ball is filled halfway with water and halfway with air, then the ball is sealed. Then, you put the plastic ball in a bowl of water. You can imagine that if the ball is translucent, you would be able to differentiate the water inside the ball from the air inside the ball. You would be able to see the difference if the ball is translucent. I will be posting pics soon, like I said, so we'll see if the air bubble is visible in the pics.

I have fridged the axie, and no, I won't be trying to manipulate its body to remove the air. I know that their skin is very delicate.

Pics coming soon!
 
OK, here are the pics:

floater2.JPG


floater3.JPG


floater4.JPG


gasline.JPG



While I was photographing him, I noticed something very alarming (you've probably noticed it already as well)- his right "shoulder" seems to be torn! When he tries to turn himself right-side-up, he often flails his arms and legs, and I'm wondering if, in an attempt to steady himself, he has been keeping his arm in a particular position. If he's been doing that for over a month, might that explain the injury to his shoulder? Here's a detailed image of the injury:

tornshoulder.JPG


He's in the fridge now...

and I just realized something else: the air that's trapped inside him seems NOT to be in his stomach at all- it seems to be BETWEEN his stomach and his skin! It MUST be air, and not edema, because nothing except air would be causing the axie to float upside down.

I had another axie (Rayson, you may remember him) who was afflicted with short toe syndrome. His body had swollen to IMMENSE proportions, but he never floated upside down. His problem was caused by ascites, not by gas/air. But I am sure that the axie in the photos above does not have ascites- it must be gas.

Thanks!
 
Hi Velaria,

Thanks for the photos. They do help immensely. (Jen this is another good case log for CC or AxSanc)

I do agree gas bubble disease is a possible (and high on list) differential. This condition normally occurs when axies are kept in water supersaturated with gases (any of the air composition). Supersaturation of water tends to occur around hot summer months. Elevated water temperature results in decreased solubility of gases. What is the current water temperature and ambient temperature? Is it summer for you? Have you noticed any bacterial or algae bloom? Have you introduced any new live plants? A combination of all these factors can contribute to supersaturation of water by gases.

Axies presented with gas bubble disease have air emboli or bubbles in their blood stream. Gases can also accumulate subdermally under the skin and even in internal organs with cavity (ie stomach). Eerily, you can even sometimes see bubbles between the toe webbings and in the eyes themselves. Left untreated, axies can die from the emboli as it severely disrupts blood circulation and perfusion. This can lead to multi organ failure due to infarctions (no blood supply). Blood capillaries can be ruptured, leading to ecchymotic bruises. These are huge purply bruises that quickly lead to skin necrosis and sloughing. You can actually see what appears to be some subdermal haemorrhage around the midline and cloacal region. The axie will be greatly stressed. The condition weakens its immune system, cause inappetance and floating and render it very susceptible to secondary infections like saprolegniasis or aeromonas infections. They will also become severely uncoordinated and has compromised mobility due to equillibrium deficits. The clinical picture quite evidently fits a lot of your patient history.

Treatment wise, i would recommend you do perform some changes to the general husbandry. Try to cool your water down to around 16-18 degree celsius. If you use an airstone or filter, reduce the setting such that you get mild aeration only. Check that your tubings are not leaky as sometimes leaks in the tubings can increase the aeration substantially. When you perform water changes, let the tap water sit in the bucket overnight to allow air to dissipate. Using water ager is a necessity. You can also consider using a spray bar for the filter outtake. Let the water return to the tank via a fine mist or trickling down the sides of the tank surface. This allows gases to dissipate and avoid stirring up more gases. If there is a concurrent bacterial infection. Antibiotics will be indicated. At this stage, i would recommend you fridge it for a month at least while you work on your main tank. Keep monitoring and if the condition deteriorates, a vet appointment will be necessary.

Other differentials i had were bloat and ascites. Based on the photos, i would say they are less likely as the swelling is confined to the abdominal region with no evidence of fluid accumulation. The limbs, neck region etc all look pretty normal.

The reddish region where you indicated the air bubble is where the liver and heart is situated. There seems to be some degree of liver enlargement (hepatomegaly), possibly due to blood congestion. Have you ever fed raw liver to your axies? If you do, i would greatly recommend stop feeding any livers. In fact i would go so far as to say cut out raw livers of any species of animal as a treat. Raw livers besides containing enzymes that can break down some nutrients when ingested, also contain a high proportion of vitamin A. Too much vitamin A causes a toxicosis. Vitamin A poisoning essentially. The first sign of this is liver enlargement.

Diet wise, bloodworms although nutritious, i find them not as wholesome as a diet for adult axies. For adult axies, i recommend earthworms and pellets as staples and blackworms and bloodworms as a healthy snack. Freeze dried tubifex worms are definitely not nutritious. I would do away with them. I also tend to avoid feeding tubifex worms, even live ones as they are normally reared in rather yucky waters and i would not be surprised if they brought along diseases or parasites.

As for the tear in the shoulder region, there could be many reasons. Firstly, the incoordination and floating may have caused physical trauma like you suggested. It could have rammed itself into something and tore the skin. Alternatively, there could be a gas emboli trapped in the fine blood capillaries in the forearm, leading to skin necrosis and sloughing. The tear in the shoulder could in turn aggravate the incoordination. There is network of nerves called the brachial plexus just around that region and sometimes an injury around that area can cause quite bad pain.

Summary - Work on tank, fridge, vet appointment, +/- antibiotics, analgesics and anti-inflammatory

Cheers.
 
I do agree gas bubble disease is a possible (and high on list) differential. This condition normally occurs when axies are kept in water supersaturated with gases (any of the air composition). Supersaturation of water tends to occur around hot summer months. Elevated water temperature results in decreased solubility of gases. What is the current water temperature and ambient temperature? Is it summer for you? Have you noticed any bacterial or algae bloom? Have you introduced any new live plants? A combination of all these factors can contribute to supersaturation of water by gases.

Thank you so much for your help, Rayson! Summer just began here very recently, and I am in one of the U.S.'s hotter states. The current water temperature is just "room temperature"- my guess, maybe somewhere around 70 degrees fahrenheit. I have a few axie tanks and a few bowls with fighter fish, and yes, I have noticed a slight increase in algae bloom in my bowls and cycled axie tanks. The tanks house the older axies, however. The younger axies are all kept in separate plastic containers, and they receive daily water changes and container scrubbings, so algae does not have a chance to accumulate in the containers. The axie in my photos is one of the younger ones that's being kept in a container. I guess the warmer weather may have contributed to the water being more gaseous, but I do let the water sit overnight before changing the axie water, just to help remove bubbles and gases, and this axie is the only one who is affected by this air bubble problem.

Axies presented with gas bubble disease have air emboli or bubbles in their blood stream. Gases can also accumulate subdermally under the skin and even in internal organs with cavity (ie stomach).

Yes, it appears to be subdermal.

Eerily, you can even sometimes see bubbles between the toe webbings and in the eyes themselves. Left untreated, axies can die from the emboli as it severely disrupts blood circulation and perfusion. This can lead to multi organ failure due to infarctions (no blood supply). Blood capillaries can be ruptured, leading to ecchymotic bruises. These are huge purply bruises that quickly lead to skin necrosis and sloughing. You can actually see what appears to be some subdermal haemorrhage around the midline and cloacal region.

Yes, I see the hemorrhage to which you're referring.

The axie will be greatly stressed. The condition weakens its immune system, cause inappetance and floating and render it very susceptible to secondary infections like saprolegniasis or aeromonas infections. They will also become severely uncoordinated and has compromised mobility due to equillibrium deficits. The clinical picture quite evidently fits a lot of your patient history.

Yes, it does fit. And I have noticed that he is experiencing equillibrium problems.

Treatment wise, i would recommend you do perform some changes to the general husbandry. Try to cool your water down to around 16-18 degree celsius.

OK, the fridge will take care of that.

If you use an airstone or filter, reduce the setting such that you get mild aeration only. Check that your tubings are not leaky as sometimes leaks in the tubings can increase the aeration substantially. When you perform water changes, let the tap water sit in the bucket overnight to allow air to dissipate. Using water ager is a necessity. You can also consider using a spray bar for the filter outtake. Let the water return to the tank via a fine mist or trickling down the sides of the tank surface. This allows gases to dissipate and avoid stirring up more gases.

I don't use a filter with my younger axies, because they're just kept in separate containers. My older axies, who are in tanks with filters, seem to be doing well, and their filtration system is very mild.

If there is a concurrent bacterial infection. Antibiotics will be indicated. At this stage, i would recommend you fridge it for a month at least while you work on your main tank. Keep monitoring and if the condition deteriorates, a vet appointment will be necessary.

OK, I'll keep him fridged. What are the characteristics of a bacterial infection? What should I be watching for?

Other differentials i had were bloat and ascites. Based on the photos, i would say they are less likely as the swelling is confined to the abdominal region with no evidence of fluid accumulation. The limbs, neck region etc all look pretty normal.

I agree.

The reddish region where you indicated the air bubble is where the liver and heart is situated. There seems to be some degree of liver enlargement (hepatomegaly), possibly due to blood congestion. Have you ever fed raw liver to your axies?

No, never.


Diet wise, bloodworms although nutritious, i find them not as wholesome as a diet for adult axies. For adult axies, i recommend earthworms and pellets as staples and blackworms and bloodworms as a healthy snack. Freeze dried tubifex worms are definitely not nutritious. I would do away with them. I also tend to avoid feeding tubifex worms, even live ones as they are normally reared in rather yucky waters and i would not be surprised if they brought along diseases or parasites.

I understand. All of my other axies are on a diet that's a combination of pellets, dried tubifex forms, and earthworms from the garden. I find that the pellets often dissolve before they're eaten, thus fouling the water, so I don't like to feed them pellets unless I don't feel like getting my hands wet. But sometimes pellets are the most convenient feeding choice because I can just throw them in the water. My axies eat earthworms whenever I dig them up, but I like feeding them tubifex worms because they can just bite it out of my hand, so the water does not get fouled by the tubifex worms. I would not imagine that freeze dried tubifex worms could harbor any diseases, would you?

At any rate, when he axie is floating on the surface of the water like that, pellets are not an option, because they sink, and then he cannot reach them. Tubifex worms are easy to feed to him because he can just bite it out of my hand. I offered him an earthworm today, and he was absolutely not interested in it. So at this point in time, it looks as if tubifex worms or bloodworms are his only feeding options. He eats both very voraciously.

As for the tear in the shoulder region, there could be many reasons. Firstly, the incoordination and floating may have caused physical trauma like you suggested. It could have rammed itself into something and tore the skin. Alternatively, there could be a gas emboli trapped in the fine blood capillaries in the forearm, leading to skin necrosis and sloughing. The tear in the shoulder could in turn aggravate the incoordination. There is network of nerves called the brachial plexus just around that region and sometimes an injury around that area can cause quite bad pain.

All of that sounds very accurate, and very terrible. I will have to keep a close watch on him.


Summary - Work on tank, fridge, vet appointment, +/- antibiotics, analgesics and anti-inflammatory

Tank water has been addressed, fridging has been addressed, I still haven't found any vets in my area who are willing to treat axies. If I do notice bacteria (please tell me what it would look like), antibiotics will be necessary, so would treatment with tetracycline be adviseable? If so, do you know what the doseage would be, and how I would administer it? Can you also recommend analgesics and anti-inflammatory medicines, and do you know what the doseages would be? And lastly, should I consider euthanasia if I notice severe hemorrhaging and/or necrosis?

I looked here: http://www.axolotl.org/health.htm, and it states that Holtfreter's solution will help with wound healing and will also help guard against bacterial and fungal infections. I don't have Holtfreter's solution, but it states that I can, instead, use a mixture of 1 tsp salt and 2 liters water. I'm thinking about just giving the axolotl a ten minute bath in the saltwater mixture. Any thoughts?

Thank you again!
 
It'll help if he can right himself. To do that you need to lower the water so that it just covers him, and then gently help him turn the right way up. If the water is low enough he should be able to keep himself the right way up and that will really help reduce the stress.
 
It'll help if he can right himself. To do that you need to lower the water so that it just covers him, and then gently help him turn the right way up. If the water is low enough he should be able to keep himself the right way up and that will really help reduce the stress.

Thanks, John! I did try that a few weeks ago, without any success. I figured that since he wasn't able to keep himself right-side-up even with the lower water level, that I should just give him a higher water level so that he's at least 100% submerged and so that his gills aren't dragging on the bottom of the container.

Would you suggest that I try the lower water level again, even though it didn't work at all before? And do you think I should try the saltwater bath?
 
Did you lower it enough to _just_ cover his back? If you did and it didn't work then don't do it again.
 
Phew.. i always go into semi panic mode when i see John commenting on a post that i responded to. Almost like the feeling I get when i am called to stand outside the principal's office. Glad no big boo boos this time. Anyway, back to the issue at hand. Valeria, if you haven't seen this link before, its Jacq's writeup on fridging. If you follow the instructions accordingly (including water level), it would substantially help the axie.

http://www.caudata.org/axolotl-sanctuary/Fridging.shtml

Saprolegniasis is the common opportunistic fungal infection. If you see wispy cottony growths around skin and gills. That is most likely it. Aeromonas hydrophila is the bacteria that causes scepticaemia or 'red leg' in sick axies. The more obvious external signs are haemorrhages under the skin. This normally starts like a pin point "petechial' type red spot anywhere on the body. Similar to gas bubble disease, the skin tends to necrose and slough off. There may be a component of concurrent aeromonas infection at this point. Fortunately the treatment method is also fridging. (+ antibiotics).

As for the enlarged liver, it can also be secondary to the gas bubble disease. The liver looks enlarged and congested (very deep purply red rather than 'fresh red'). This can be due to the poor blood perfusion and circulation as a result of the air emboli.

i don't think freeze dried tubifex worms will harbour parasites or bacteria due to the processing. However, they are low in nutrients and really would not do much in terms of nutrition. For a sick axie, it is better to feed them with nutrient dense food rather than fill them up with 'fillers' of low nutrition content. Since pellets and earthworms are not practical for you, i would go with bloodworms and live blackworms as the main food source for now.

I would try stabalise the patient with just the friding process for a week or two first and hold off with the salt baths. Firstly, there is no direct indication for the use of the salt baths at the moment as i can't see any signs of fungal infection. Aeromonas infection tends to haematogenic (blood borne) and thus salt baths do very little if any good. Secondly for a sick axie, further subjecting them to salt baths at this stage can stress them out to the point of being fatal. It is way better to let it gain strength and recuperate first.

The only way to accurate diagnose what type of bacterial infection there is, if any, is to perform a agar culture or blood bottle culture. I have to emphasize that your vet would be the best person to administer any medication. They may not be familiair with exotics but they will be trained to administer the correct type, dose and frequency of medication in the correct route. Please do not attempt to medicate your axie yourself with human antibiotics. Veterinary antibiotics are formulated to have appropriate potency/concentration for animal use.

I can give you a general overview of my approach. In the event your vet requires further info on dosage etc. i would be glad to help (you can email me). If i want to give an emphirical broad spectrum therapy (while waiting for culture results). I will use amikacin and piperacillin +/- metronidazole. This combination will target gram positive, gram negative and anaerobic bacteria. Vets may also use baytril (enrofloxacin). This antibiotic is rather broad spectrum and in healthier axies would be quite suitable as well. However in very sick axies, amikacin and piperacillin combi is more effective and safer.

If aeromonas is found to be the cause. Antibiotics that treat gram negative bacteria will be indicated. I would choose gentamicin with prior fluid therapy with amphibian ringers solution to improve kidney perfusion. Gentamicin is nephrotoxic and can damage the kidneys if administered wrongly.

All antibiotics will be administered via an intraperitoneal injection directly into the abodominal cavity. I do not believe in 'drenching' a sick axie with medication through an oral route. I can provide dosage and frequency if your vet requires.

I tend not to use tetracyclines in amphibians in general. Tetracyclines are very skin irritant and can cause skin necrosis and sloughing.

Other things i might do is to provide nutritional support - Vitamins, electrolytes, glucose, all which can be given orally or injectable.

I would use meloxicam (metacam) for analgesia and anti-inflammatory. They are rather safe and effective. Do NOT use any local anaesthetics/analgesics such as lidocaine, benzocaine etc. They are lethal to axies and giving them that is a one way ticket to axie heaven.

Euthanasia is always an option. If the axie has poor prognosis, suffering and deteriorating despite treatment, or requires expensive treatment that may not be financially feasible for you, especially for a prolonged duration, humanely putting it down can be the only valid option.

Cheers.
 
John, I tried lowering the water level again (yes, just low enough to cover the axie's back), and there has been *some* success with that. Since having done it yesterday, I have, at times, discovered him right-side-up, while other times, I will discover him upside down again. It looks as if it is somewhat helpful, which is better than nothing.

Rayson, thank you for all of your great information. I will keep him in the fridge with a low water level, feed him bloodworms, perform daily water changes, and watch his condition closely. I will forego the salt bath, and I will keep looking for a vet that is willing to see him.

If pellets are a much better nutritional source for all of my axies, then I will need to buy more. Everywhere I've found on the internet sells them in such huge quantities- can anyone refer me to a site that sells them in reasonable quantities?

Thank you!
 
Hi Velaria,

Just a note to also try live blackworms if possible. Bloodworms are nutritious no doubt, but offering a variety will ensure they get all the essential nutrition.

Cheers.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that here in the U.S., what we refer to as "bloodworms" are truly blackworms. I think it's a common misnomer here that's just become really prevalent. The worms to which I'm referring are a VERY dark brownish-red, almost black. They have to be kept in the fridge and rinsed every day. Aren't those actually blackworms? I think we call them bloodworms here because they appear to have blood leaking from their bodies when they die and the water goes foul. TRUE bloodworms are, I believe, much more red than the worms in my fridge.

And forgive me for asking again, but does anyone know where I can buy pellets in small quantity?

Thanks again for all your help!
 
Hi Velaria,

Chances are if the worms you are currently feeding are live, they are blackworms. Bloodworms tend to come in frozen cubes or gel packs. Here are some links with photos that show the difference between blackworms and bloodworms. Some pet shops may call live blackworms as bloodworms or tubifex worms.

http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/worms.shtml

http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/microfoods.shtml

If you are currently feeding blackworms, that is excellent. Blackworms alone are sufficient even as a sole food souce as they contain all the essential nutrients.

As for pellets, have you tried googling for online aquarium shops that stock and deliver axolotl pellets? You can also try ebay. There are several brands around. I personally use a brand called aqua master. It has a funny picture of an axolotl on the front label that looks a bit like a monkey. There are other types around such as Allpet. They come in about 80-150g containers.

Cheers.
 
Thanks for the info about the food, Rayson!

Update: The axie is still in the fridge. Most of the time, I will discover him right-side-up, but that's only because the water level is so low. If I put more water in his container, he floats upside down... and I still do discover him upside down about 20% of the time.

He is completely disinterested in any type of food that I offer him, and I'm worried about the fact that he isn't eating.

As far as his injured shoulder, I don't know how it's doing because I tend to try to help him right himself immediately whenever I discover him upside down, and I can only view his injured shoulder when he is upside down.

The air is still trapped under his stomach skin, and he doesn't seem to be getting any better. On the upside, however, he doesn't seem to be getting any worse, either.

Should I take him out of the fridge for a few hours so he can warm up? Do you think it may stimulate his appetite? Should I post another photo of his belly for the experts to see?

Please help, and thank you in advance!

Tina

edit: and when he is right side up, he seems to still have a problem with equillibrium- always swimming in circles. Sigh!
 
Hi Velaria,

Have you made a vet appointment? I think a shot of antibiotics and supporting vitamins/glucose/electrolytes might be in order.

Meanwhile i will continue fridging. Stabalising a deteriorating condition by itself is a progessive step. While fridged, do not worry about the axie being inappetant. It is expected and normal.

Keep the water level low to prevent it floating.

Cheers.
 
Thanks, Rayson.

No, I haven't made a vet appointment. I can't seem to find anyone who treats axolotls. I've called everywhere. I would drive five hours if I could find someone, but I can't find anyone :(

So keep doing what I've been doing, and hope that he gets better... ok. How long can he go without food?
 
Hi Velaria,

I would say safely up to 2 months. Have you tried live blackworms or small pieces of prawn? I find that most sick axies tend to prefer those over other food types. Alternatively, you can try making a mash out of a variety of food types in a food processor. You can have a doughy blend of moistened pellets, shrimp, worms, fish etc. You can then roll the mash into small 'gravel' sized portions and offer to the axie.

Would you be able to get some calcium gluconate from your local vet? They come in solution, powdered, even tableted forms. If possible get the solution type. If you can get some, i can write up a catered treatment plan for your axie where you give it a calcium gluconate bath. This would help replenish some glucose and calcium.

Cheers.
 
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