Ambystoma maculatum questions

<font color="0077aa"><font face="symbol"></font><font face="arial,helvetica"></font> I have a few questions concerning 2 ambystoma maculatums I have. First of all, I have them housed in a terrarium setting with 6 bird voiced tree frogs. Both species get along fine without any conflicts whatsoever. I have a 2 cup water dish with gravel and stones for the tree frogs. First question I have is I can't seem to nail down the sex of both salamanders. I've searched online but still can't get clear answers. One is moderately larger and more plump than the other. When I got them, both were equal size. Is the larger one the male? Also, should I provide a semi-aquatic setup for the salamanders in the event I do have a male and female? If so, what's the recommended water depth?</font>} Thanks for the input....awesome site!

Hi Meghan:

"Both species get along fine without any conflicts whatsoever"

I have to disagree, there's a fundamental conflict of temperature here. The treefrogs need warm weather (75F-85F) and A. maculatum prefers temps of 68 and under, the type of temperatures one finds underground.

Males will have a more swollen cloaca than females, and will be slimmer overall. The cloaca will not be noticeable unless they are sexually mature. Spotted salamanders have not been bred in conventional tanks so I don't know that there's much of a point in you trying to make a breeding pond in their tank. Check out the A. tigrinum care sheet at www.caudata.org/cc and fix the maculatum up accordingly.

Hi Nate,
I have disagree with you on this one with regards to the temperatures. Bird voiced tree frogs will do just fine in the same temperature range as the spotted salamanders. They are active in the spring in the northern parts of their range when the temps are well below 68 F.
As bird-voiced tree frogs are one of the smaller hylids I would be more concerned a good sized female maculatum would make a snack of the frog.
Ed

Hey, thanks for the replies! I've had these frogs in with the salamanders for well over 8 months and haven't lost a frog yet. I did my homework on looking up the bird voiced frogs as for temps etc. I wouldn't jeopardize them if I thought they'd be salie food! I was reviewing some posts here about people successfully breeding these types of salies in captivity. I was just going on the basis of those posts for changing their housing. Does it sound like I have a pair? Thanks again...

Hi Meghan,
Eight months is still a short period of time and may simply be that salamander just has not had the chance as of yet.
Ed

Meghan,
I wish it were not true, but the odds of two different species getting along for their entire lifespan (20+ years) is slim----I did not know this until I had read another post where it was suggested that the person look at this link:

http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/Mixing_disasters.shtml

Something to consider---the members in this forum (not including myself) are highly knowledgeable and have vast experience in the field of caudata---definitely lots to learn from these people, that's for sure. It's pretty humbling, but it is a place where there will be an answer for every caudate question you may have. Welcome to the forum!!

Hi Leanne
I would suspect that the frogs do not have any where near as long a lifespan as the spotteds. So far in my experience the temperate small hylids look to have an average of about 4 years for a lifespan.
Ed

Hey Ed! I keep a close watch on them and even have seen the tree frogs resting right next to the sals for long periods of time. Have yet to see any attempts at gobbling them up. Of course there are firsts but still... I've noticed the sals even just walking around them. Thanks for the advice Leanne!

Ed,
Ah, ok---thanks for the info! All the more reason to separate them from the spotteds so they can live their 4 years fully and assuredly