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It was so horrible :'(

J

jenny

Guest
i was just watchin harriet and then she snapped at one of my guppies and struggled eating it but then spat it out and i thought the guppi was dead but i felt so bad so now they are all in another tank and the guppie that got eaten is recovering! these trout pellet things...can they just live off those or is it best to give them live food sometimes? wat about blood worms cubes
 
M

mary

Guest
Axi's love catching live food!!! They can live off of the pellet things, but it's natrual for them to want to catch and eat their food. Sometimes they have a bit of trouble hanging on to the food in their mouth - especially if the guppie is putting up a fight! I often find a half dead guppie swimming around cause it escaped from the axi's grip - but most of the time it is in a pretty bad way so i kill it and then hold it infront of the axolotl's face and he/she just eats it. Nothing wrong with axi's eating gupies.
 
J

jenny

Guest
ive had my guppies in there a couple weeks though and they dont bother with them i just moved my axys in a small tank while im tryner make em breed by makin the water cold and put guppies in to so cos the guppie was real close to it harriet went for it.

good news!! i have finally found an axy nearish me! a fully grown aparently yellow one im goin gettin it on saturday! hurrah! ive sent the pet shop an email with a pic on how to sex em though cos he doesnt know how to sex it. i cant wait! ive called it fijibob!
 
M

mik

Guest
lol congrats on new axie jenny. If you aren't keen of feeding guppies try earthworms. They love 'em. Even Moonpie my smallest (125mm)will wrestle and scoff down a 50mm worm without too much hastle.

I know it sound sick but eveytime they have got one there's a bit of worm hanging out of the mouth. Reminds of Gene Simmons from KISS...lol.

Must try get a photo of it one day soon. The axie not GS.
 
J

jenny

Guest
i dont mind givin them earthworms cos they dont have eyes lol. but its just having to dig for worms then clean them then dangle them in their face and the worms slipping out my hand (and no i refuse to use some kinda pointy stick to skew it on) and then the axys dont see it or miss it when they snap for it and then it quickly diggin in the stones then me having to try dig for it and make elizabeth even more stressed than he is! and his tail has gone pinker! harriet i think wud b ok transporting to another tank to feed but elizabeth no way. ive tried.. he wont eat wen i move him. im gonna try pelles. whats the proper name of these pellets and how much shud i feed them. by the way.....i came home tonight. the guppie was dead and i didnt feel so bad. i feel so bad that i didnt feel so bad. but they are all back in the same tank so the axys can eat em.
 
D

donna

Guest
How big are these guppies? and are they just the normal guppies that you buy from a fish shop?
 
J

jenny

Guest
i get just normal ones. they tend to be quite expensive but i found a place that sold them for 50p each. but i bought 400worms from wormsdirect for £6
 
K

kim

Guest
Donna,

It is not adivsable to feed axies fish unless you know where they came from as they can carry alot of harmful diseases.

I do sometimes feed them to my axies but i know that they are ok as they are the babies that have come from my mum tropical tank.

Just take care when buying them if you go ahead.
 
M

mik

Guest
On subject of feeder fish and diseases. I have been trying to get about 1000 feeder fish from a local supplier for months now without success.

Reason being, everytime he gets a batch they're all dead or dying on arrival. Feeder fish generally aren't the king of the crop and are subject to illness without the added stress of travelling. For my part I've given up actively looking for them. If I do manage to get any they will be in quarantine for a little while and only my strongest axies will get a chance with them.

Until then my harem of breeder/feeder mollies will be my only source of feeder fish.
 
E

edward

Guest
Mik,
If you can buy in that quantity check the quantity price on swords and platys. They are often very close in cost.

Ed
 
L

leah

Guest
Wow Mik, you actually have room to house 1000 feeders?!? Where?!? Lucky!!!

The reason so many "feeder fish" are often dead or dying on arrival to the store is not that they are any more susceptible to illness than other fish, but the conditions they're kept in. It drives me nuts hearing this over and over again, and I'm disappointed to hear you saying that they're sick *because* of what they are, with no regard to how they're kept.

Look at the tanks the stores keep these fish in: 10-20 gallon tanks holding HUNDREDS of fish at a time. Just think of the water quality... oi! The stress of traveling has very little to do with it, I'm sure, unless by stress you were referring to oxygen depravation and poisoning? It's bad enough in a tank, but how well do you think these fish fare in plastic bags that have more fish than water in them? It's not surprising that most suffocate or die from ammonia poisoning before they reach the store! There's nothing special about feeder fish. They're usually the excess/unwanted spawns of livebearers, and young comet goldfish- nowhere near as popular as the fancy varieties, and far harder to sell except as "feeders." They're not arriving dead at your store because they're feeders, but because no one cares enough to give them a chance. They're just going to be eaten anyway, right?

Yes, disease is more likely to spread among feeders than other fish, but only because they're overcrowded and stressed to start- ideal conditions for disease to set in. Some stores will even feed you the BS that feeder fish only have a natural lifespan of a few weeks, to explain the high mortality rates. "Feeder" goldfish SHOULD live for 20+ years if properly cared for. Guppies, platies, mollies, and whatever else you may be feeding also live for a number of years. Mollies in particular are misunderstood- these are actually a brackish water species, and while they do survive and will even reproduce in freshwater, are WAY hardier and longer-lived if kept in light brackish conditions.

If fish stores would actually give these animals the appropriate living conditions needed to keep them healthy and happy it would eliminate the need to quarantine new livestock at home and weed out any possible illnesses. But they won't, so we quarantine. You know this is why we quarantine new animals. Fish, axolotls, frogs... everything. This is a great site and I love that people here actively promote quarantine practices, but I will not stand back and let you tell people that Feeder fish have a natural tendency towards sickness and that THIS is why they should be quarantined. That's a load of <font color="ff0000">&#149;</font><font color="ff0000">&#149;</font><font color="ff0000">&#149;</font><font color="ff0000">&#149;</font> and breeds ignorance. There are enough people already going around with the notion that a fish is "just a fish." Stop giving people a reason to use the excuse that "it was just a feeder fish" whenever one of these dies, as they run out to buy another dozen. These are sensitive living beings that deserve better, and people should have higher expectations as well- Like you did, or anyone else who's taken the time to set up a breeding tank. You obviously knew that these fish are not born sickly, thought you could do better, and thus have a healthier, sustainable food source for your axolotls- Why bother breeding them otherwise? The purpose of sites like this one should be to educate people, not to regurgitate the same misinformation that's already out there.
 
L

leah

Guest
Don't mean to sound so angry... it's been a long day...
happy.gif
 
K

kim

Guest
I have to say a thank you to you Leah, With out information like this, people will always believe what they get told first time.

Thanks for correction and I shall now no longer say that they will die jut because they are feeder fish.
happy.gif
 
M

mik

Guest
Lol Leah thats quite a speech. You're absolutley right in your first two paragraphs. An extensive explanation that I tried to avoid.

I've seen them arrive in large plastic bags and as you say more fish than water. I think that's pretty stressy. I have been informed that feeders aren't the best stock on a couple of occaisions Regardless we must both agree if they arrive in poor shape then they are more susceptible to disease and by the time you get them home, an illness may be rife amongst your new stock. A sensible precuation is quarantine so as not to infect your desired popuplation...in my case axies.

I wasn't intending to tell people that they have a natural tendency to be prone to disease.

I fully agree that they should be kept as huamanely as possible and wasn't suggesting that you just dump them. I have my breeder mollies (approx 20 adults and dunno how many babies at moment) in a tank with weeds and rocks, filters, heaters, water changes etc. But I have no real interest in them. I originally set it up as an experiment to see if they would breed and thrive. I didn't even know if I was buying good or bad just so many males and females. I had quite a few losses at beginning for various reasons but have been better or luckier with them more lately. At the moment I wouldn't dream of feeding to the axies the water is very cold in their tank compared to the mollies and they would be killed almost instantly. Un-necessarily unkind and a waste of food. My breeders will never achieve the numbers to become a sustainable source only an occaisional treat - quite expensive on reflection!

Tell you what Leah, think your day was bad. I'll trade you a day on my current project for a week of yours...nightmare!
 
P

pamela

Guest
I agree Leah! I actually have 5 goldfish tanks. One is home for 7 feeders. I got them about a year and a half ago - they were some of the smallest feeders I have seen. I got several, knowing that only a few would survive. The ones that have survived are now over 5" long, very healthy, and very beautiful! My goal is that they live for 20+ years.
 
E

edward

Guest
One of the additional problems with feeders is that they are pulled from the pond, cooled down to 45 F and not fed for 48 hours or so, they are then sent to the distributer and again cooled and not fed. Upon shipment to the pet store the feeders are usually not kept cool and are allowed to warm up in transit. This can take as long as two weeks from collection to ending in the petstore tank.
I'm not too concerned with the shipping as the fish are typically tranquilized and the bags inflated with O2 but I agree most pet stores house them in insufficiently large aquaria.

Ed
 
C

clarence

Guest
I have a tank just for feeders, about 1 per gallon. That way, I can know they are not only healthy, but nutritious to boot.
 
V

veronica

Guest
I have found it useful to have a feeder tank for fishies for my piranha so i can feed the feeders some super-healthy food for a while before my P's get ahold of them. Goldfish are especially fatty, from what I understand, so they only get them as treats to exercise their hunting skills.
 
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    with axolotls would I basically have to keep buying and buying new axolotls to prevent inbred breeding which costs a lot of money??
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    Not necessarily but if you’re wanting to continue to grow your breeding capacity then yes. Breeding axolotls isn’t a cheap hobby nor is it a get rich quick scheme. It costs a lot of money and time and deditcation
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