Cynops pyrrhogaster Succumbed to Bloat

I had mentioned in a thread yesterday that I woke to find one of my Cp's bloated. Previously this animal had seemed "off" to me for several days, in that it was resting more than normal and not hunting black worms like its tank mates. But its appearance was normal until the night before last when I noticed some neck/throat swelling. The next morning the whole body was bloated and last night it died. I am very sad that it didn't make it, and that to me it seemed to occur very rapidly. I was even going to take it in to my local herp vet on Monday, as that is my day off next week. I really thought that bloat only occurred in new imports or with bad husbandry. But this animal was a LTC that I obtained from a fellow forum member in Spring of 2006. I do water changes once a week - its a 20g tank and I change 5g at a time - and my water quality has not changed according to my test kit. Is my test kit wrong? Its just one of those little strips that you add drops of water to but honestly I have questioned its accuracy in the past when I have cycled tanks and ammonia never gets very high. And the most recent change to the tank was earlier this spring when I added a water lettuce plant that I first left in a bucket of water outside and did water changes for a month to try to prevent introducing any chemicals to my tank. Has anyone else had a newt develop bloat that was a LTC and that you felt you had taken good care of? I feel not only saddened that I lost this newt, but am now more than a little paranoid that its former tank mates may be at risk. I have kept the remains of the deceased newt - would it be worth while to take it in for necropsy to see if I can get a diagnoses? Should I do a complete water change in the tank? Or should I just stop freaking out because sometimes newts get sick and die?
Thanks for comments and ideas,
Heather

hi Heather...i think you'll find bloat is not always a bacterial problem but can also be down to internal organ problems, i'm sure if Ed reads your thread he will be able to help you further.the speed of which your newt succumbed seems to suggest it was maybe not bacterial.

I would suggest doing a good cleaning and partial water change, particularly if the animal died in the tank. But I think you can follow your own suggested advice to "just stop freaking out because sometimes newts get sick and die". I really doubt that this was due to ammonia or anything like that.

I doubt that it's worth a necropsy; most likely this will just identify fluid accumulation. It's pretty hard to identify subtle problems with a newt's internal organs. I guess it might be worth doing, if you have someone good to do it, and it doesn't cost much... but what are the chances of that? You could do it yourself, but you need a dissecting kit and a strong stomach!

The fact that the bloat progressed so quickly suggests to me that this may have involved some kind of infection, actually (purely speculation). However, you noticed that the newt was "off" even before the bloating developed. The death of an amphibian is rarely due to a single cause. The newt probably had some other problem that led it to become infected (or have organ failure, or whatever caused it). The organisms that cause disease are fairly ubiquitous; it's usually a matter of which animals are weak enough to be susceptible.

I also lost 1 LTC C. pyrrhogaster this season. It completely quit eating, and isolation and cooling didn't help. In the past, I have also lost an LTC newt to bloat, but that case developed very slowly and didn't involve the neck - it was not a rapid death as yours was.

Thanks guys. I had read that bloat may be caused by internal organ problems, and I was thinking maybe renal just from what I had read on the article about bloat in newts. I think I am still going to call and ask about necropsy at the exotic vet tomorrow and get a quote for cost. Depending on the cost, it may be worth it to me. I have only ever dealt with the exotic vet once in the past when my original Cp developed an eye infection. The infection did clear up (and I luckily still have that newt), but I don't know how good they would be at caudate pathology. I am sure the doctors I work with would be interested in opening it up, but I doubt they would be able to tell me anything. And I have assisted in necropsy's before so I think I could handle this little one!
I placed the newt in a quarantine tank yesterday morning when I saw its condition, so luckily it did not die in the main tank. I did still do a partial water change this morning, however, and also tested the water. All parameters were within normal range, but I did notice that my test kit expires next month so I will definitely be purchasing a new kit in the very near future.
I just feel really bad. I mean, I had noticed something was not right with this animal days earlier and I did not do anything about it. If it had been one of my dogs, I would not have wasted any time getting bloodwork done on them. I do realize that I am so much more limited in what I can do medically for these little guys versus my dogs, but I wish I had done SOMETHING, like earlier quarantine, fridge cooling, posting here for ideas, just anything that possibly could have made a difference or bought some time...

I would speculate that it was due to an infection as well. Necropsies can be expensive particuarly if you get histopathology done on the newt (this maybe the only real way to tell the cause). Depending on the experience of the vet, they may do the direct necropsy at the clinic and then send the newt out for the histopathology (often using a company like this one http://www.zoopath.com/ ) (I know one of the vets in this company and he is an excellant exotic animal pathologist) but you have to have a vet submit the samples.

Ed

Thanks very much for the info, Ed. I didn't call the exotic vet today but I still want to. I want to get an idea of what they would be willing to do for newts in case this or something similar happens in the future and I need their expertise.
And thanks for the condolences, Mapleotte. I don't think its ever easy to lose something that you have taken care of, be it lost through old age, accident, or illness.