Ammonia

Hey guys,

We moved our axolotl into a new tank a few months back after an 8 week cycling period - everything was fine, no nitrates or nitrites and no ammonia was present.

However since we put the axolotl in, ammonia is becoming present. We are using ammonia remover to get rid of it but is there anything else we can do to build up the good bacteria?

Cheers

ideally you need to stop using any chemicals to correct it,
daily water changes of 20-30% will correct the problem.
i hate to say this but your tank was obviously not cycled if there where no nitrates present.
a healthy tanks parameters should be ,
nitrite 0
ammonia 0
nitrates 40-80 pmm
what did you have in the tank to help it cycle? as you need something that will produce bacteria.

digger said:

ideally you need to stop using any chemicals to correct it,
daily water changes of 20-30% will correct the problem.
i hate to say this but your tank was obviously not cycled if there where no nitrates present.
a healthy tanks parameters should be ,
nitrite 0
ammonia 0
nitrates 40-80 pmm
what did you have in the tank to help it cycle? as you need something that will produce bacteria.

Click to expand...

When I said there was no nitrates present, I just presumed there wasnt as the reading was fine on the 5-in-1 test strips.

We just put in some crushed up fish food and left it to rot in a bid to build up bacteria.

What should we do now? If ammonia is present, does that mean there is not enough bacteria?

Crushed flake food will not properly cycle your tank in preperation for living animals as Digger mentioned. The only way, IMHO, is too add bioload (animals) to the tank. Start small and increase the load slowly untill you reach the desired stocking levels. That is easy to do with a community tank where there are 20-30 fish that can be added slowly but with a single larger specimen it is more complicated.

There are several ways to get what you need though.

1. Take a canister filter and fill it with the substrate you are using in your tank. Place it in/on an established tahk and it will be properly colonized in a few weeks. A friend with a healthy tank is an asset to be called upon from time to time.

2. Set-up you rank the way you want and cycle it with a few starter fish. I find white cloud minnows to be great for this. I keep them in there for a few weeks till I see a spike and subsequent normalization in Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate in that order. Once Nitrate normalizes you can add the axie. The cycle will repeat due to the increased bioload but it will be quick. The fish will keep the axie on the prowl as well as serve as a source of food that you have basically had quaranteened for 30-60 days. Obviously if the fish seem ill in any way don't add the axie

3. Set-up you rank the way you want and add your axie. Axies produce a decent ammount of waste so you will see the nitrogen cycle start with a vengance.

In all three of these scenarios the cycling will take a few weeks. In 1 and 2 the cycle will be quick as the existing colony of bacteria only need to adjust their population density to handle the new bio-load. Scenario 3 takes the longest as the entire process needs to take place from scratch.

In all three scenarios, monitor Nitrate and do 20% water changes weekly till the Nitrate normalizes to zero. Also remember that in an unfiltered tank with a bare bottom there is little surface area for colonization and a single heavy feeding can cause a drop in water quality if you don't remove uneaten food quickly. Probably more than you wanted but I was feeling chatty. Happy Saturday.

I initially used the 5 in 1 test strips as I beleived they would be far more convenient than individual tests. In the end I chucked the strips as the readings were very erratic and they never once coresponded even remotley to the water samples tested at the fish shop. I now do weekly tests with ammonai/nitrate/nitrae and ph to monitor the water conditions..I even record the readings in a note book, plus any events that had occured regarding the axolotl..I have problems remembering numbers!!
I had thought my original tank had cycled but then after adding the axolotl, extra plants and then sand it upset all the readings so i then needed to do daily 20-30 % water changes..and this felt like it went on forever. Now apart from the weekly 20/30 % water changes every thing water quality wise has been good.
Now off to see how well we loose in the Rugby!!

We have the 5-in-1 test strips but a seperate ammonia test kit!

When we "cycled" the tank - we put everything in the tank that was going to be in it - apart from our axolotl and after we were satified with what we thought were good readings, we put him in. Its only now that are starting to think there is a problem with the ammonia.

Do you think the only way to cure the problem is daily 20-30% water changes then? Sorry for being stupid but how will this help to build up bacteria?

Good luck with the rugby, you'll need it

The 5 in 1 test strips aren't very accurate compared to the individual test tube ones. The daily water changes will keep the toxins down in the water so your axolotl can stay in there safely without being stressed from too much ammonia/nitrite building up. Stop using the ammonia remover, products like this, don't actually remove the ammonia it binds it and is only a temporary fix so you will get swings in water parameters. Stick with daily testing and daily waterchanges if need be - any ammonia/nitrites over 0 and/or nitrates over 80ppm. You may also need to purchase a nitrite test tube kind to monitor nitrite levels properly (I do remember when Bellabelloo was using it - sounds very confusing and unpredictable with results).

I think 20-30% daily water changes are too great. 20-30% weekly will be fine. When you remove 20% of the tank water and replace it with the same volume of clean aged tap water you are decreasing but not eliminating waste. Their will still be plenty of ammonia left ot fuel the cycle. A good test kit is really essential during this period and I test daily once Nitrates are detected. If the 20-30% weekly water change is not decreasing the Nitrates you can do it twice weekly. That size change daily is too stressfull in my opinion though I know others feel it is fine. When doing frequent large water changes watch for signs of stress and slow down when the Nitrates are decreasing. I deally they should be zero but with large messy feeders and no substrate that is not likely.

test Kit

I looked up the test kits and this is a decent one that is pretty cheap.

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+4345+4454&pcatid=4454

If I have gone off the reservation by posting a link I appologize.

that one would be a lot better, i also use one like that and find it more reliable

20 or 30% Daily or every two days worth of waterchanges is not large and far less stressful for your axolotl/s than having the ammonia/nitrites build up. Some people do 10% daily, which in my opinion doesn't make that much of an impact decreasing the ammonia/nitrites as does the 20 or 30% waterchange or go to the other extreme leave their tanks for a week or so and do a large 75%+ waterchange in the hopes. they will fix things, which it doesn't.

Since owning axolotls, I've used 20=30% waterchanges, daily or every two days dependant on water parameter tests, both when I've cycled with animals in the tank and at other times when there have been any ammonia/nitrites showing in the water. Far less stress for our axolotls. Otherwise our standard practice is weekly watertesting of all tanks before a weekly waterchange.

you need nitrates it is the nitrite and ammonia to be 0 to ensure healthy living enviroment.

MRIGUY said:

I looked up the test kits and this is a decent one that is pretty cheap.

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+4345+4454&pcatid=4454

If I have gone off the reservation by posting a link I appologize.

Click to expand...

That looks great. Only problem is that I am in the UK! Thanks anyway.

Our ammonia test kit is like that - the tube with two bottle that we have to drop in.

Hey guys,

Just to update. We have been doing 20-30% water changes daily but the ammonia levels are not going down. Is there any way to counteract the ammonia other than water changes?

Cheers,

Ross

What you are describing is not making a lot of sense to me. If you are doing a 20-30% water change daily, you ARE decreasing the ammonia. The only scenario I see that makes this possible is that your ammonia readings are far above the upper limit of your test kit and though you are decreasing them with the water changes, they have not dropped into the test kit range yet. Just a theory but it is a possible explanation.

Sorry, I forgot to answer your question. There is no chemical agen that will remove/chelate/render harmless etc the ammonia in your tank. There are ammonia removal agents but they are really just bandaids and do not solve the problem. In the long run the best solution is to balance bioload against filtration and water changes.

Or your ammonia test is expired and no longer working properly. Have you taken a water sample to a pet shop to get another opinion?

Hey,

Our axolotl was going crazy in his tank - swimming about and just being really out of character. We did the 5-in-1 test strip and all the readings were fine (I realise now that these kits arent the most reliable).

We then did an ammonia test and the reading was 1.0. This ammonia test kit is the kind where you mix together two chemicals and tank water and shake then leave for 5 minutes. The ideal would be that the water turns yellow but just now it is a really light green.

Earlier on in this thread I was given the advice to do daily 20-30% water changes to reduce the levels of ammonia but a week later and its not made much of a difference.

Any advice would be appreciated.

it sometimes take longer than a week but i assure you it is the safest way, your readings will come right once the tank has finished cycling provided you follow the water change regime, also making sure you remove all waste produced by your axies and dead/uneaten food within the hour as this will just continue to make ammonnia increase.
one of my 6 foot tanks took nearly 3 weeks but it came right in the end.

We think the problem was the sand. Our axolotl was going crazy and crashing about so we took him out and put him in a bucket while we investigated. There was a really strong muddy smell coming from the tank and the sand was black underneath the top layer.

We have removed all of the sand - which had an unbareable smell attached to it - and put him back in his tank. He has now calmed down and the ammonia level is 0.

Think we have solved the mystery?