Axie not eating!

Well the Ren (the pinky whitey one) & Stumpy (the wild type) Saga continues

Amonia levels were a lot better, although they are now very up and down again. We have been doing 30% water changes every 3 or 4 days.

Stumpy is eating fine, and considering what i have read about Axolotls, he is so entertaining, always on the go. Who needs telly when you have him!

Poor Ren though hasn't eaten for about a week. Can't tempt him or her with anything (we think he is a boy) Even a slug tonight was not good enough, and considering we are very super sensitive and freak out at the thought of feeding a live worm horrid (although we have tried and they didn't seem impressed). He is normally quite partial to a prawn or a bit of trout.

We have also noticed his gills have paled right down, they were very pink before. He is swimming like a crazy thing tonight which is very out of character. He is normally shy and spends a lot of time hidden in the (plastic) plants.

do we have anything to worry about?

Jules is thinking about taking them out of the tank at the weekend and putting a lot of the water in a big tank, then thoroughly cleaning the tank and plants, and adding sand to the bottom. Is this a good idea? He is also worried that Ren might morph although surely he would spend a lot more time trying to get air, is that possible?

Well, the fact that your axolotl is not eating can be caused by lots of things... for instance water quality, or the type of food it is... also if you have no reason to perhaps you should put it down to 20% each week, as the healthy bacteria in the tank needs a chance. I can't help you much on the eating problem because as I said there could be lots of reasons. Though the fact that there swimming around alot suggests a water quality problem or lack of oxygen. Finally, what you have meantioned cleaning wise, might not be such a good idea, only if you had a seperate tank able to haold them for at least 7 days, so you could cycle their current tank. Sand is good idea, just as long as you make sure it's not 'builders' or 'marine' sand... 'Play' sand is what people usually use, you simply filter it, wash it, and add it. Also the possibility of your Axolotl morphing is very unlikely... alot of people mistake gils becoming shorter as a sign of this when its more commonly a sign of heavily oxygenated water. Hope that helps and best of luck.

Thank you for your help. We are extremely sad to say that our Ren passed away in the night Wednesday. We are gutted. Sorry if we are sad, but we love our guys so much. Do you think Stumpy will be ok on his own? Do Axolotls live ok in solitary, or are they best in pairs? it was only just over a week that Ren didn't eat, and we tried him every day with a variety of food. We are going to work a million times harder on the water quality before we think about getting a mate for Stumpy. We will come back and check on the requirements before we introduce a mate x

I'm sorry about Ren

Axolotls live well enough in solitary or in company (in company depends on the size of the tank and providing enough hides so they can spend 'time out' from one another). What size is your tank?

If you get a companion for Stumpy, you will need to quarantine the new axie for 30 days before introducing to your tank and Stumpy - this ensures no diseases are introduced to your tank and thus to Stumpy.

What are your water parameters? (Ammonia/Nitrite/Nitrate/PH and Temperature) If you could provide these it would help us ascertain if there is anything amiss in your water quality.

Cheers Jacq.

Thanks for the reply Jacq.

The tank is 3 foot long, 1 foot front to back (15" high).

Readings in the tak are Nitrite 0.25, PH approx 7.4, Nitrate 0, Ammonia ranges from 4-8 (we seem to be fighting a losing battle)

Following members advice we have been doing approx 20% water changes every couple of days.

Stumpy seems to be doing ok. Has been eating fine. Doesn't appear to be stressed. Gills aren't curled. His personality hasn't changed.

Stumpy seems to like human contact. He likes to be hand fed, and even when fed with tongs, is very inquisitive, and likes to follow the tongs, and seems to want to be stroked! He also seems to like being talked to, and seems to respond when he hears my voice. Is that normal?!

We really want to add sand to the bottom of the tank, and get rid of the last few pebbles. Is this safe to do when he is still in the tank, or do we need to put him elsewhere while this is done? We got rid of nearly all of the pebbles at the same time of getting rid of the live plants in the hope that this would help the ammonia levels to drop. Also when we set up the tank we were worried about having a bare bottom on the tank as we had read that they find it hard to grip, so we used some rubber car mats which we put on the bottom. When water changes are done, we do lift them up and suck out the mess underneath, but could this be part of the cause of the water levels?

Thanks very much for your reply, any further info would be much appreciated

Vicster1979 said:

The tank is 3 foot long, 1 foot front to back (15" high).

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That's a nice size tank :happy:

Vicster1979 said:

Readings in the tak are Nitrite 0.25, PH approx 7.4, Nitrate 0, Ammonia ranges from 4-8 (we seem to be fighting a losing battle)

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That Ammonia is dangerously high. You will need to do 20-50% water changes daily - every two days as you have been doing is not sufficient.

Vicster1979 said:

Stumpy seems to be doing ok. Has been eating fine.

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Well that's the important thing. Keep a close eye on him though with that high ammonia.

Vicster1979 said:

Stumpy seems to like human contact. He likes to be hand fed, and even when fed with tongs, is very inquisitive, and likes to follow the tongs, and seems to want to be stroked! He also seems to like being talked to, and seems to respond when he hears my voice. Is that normal?!

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They are funny aren't they. I know it's cute, but don't stroke him - this can have an detrimental effect on his natural slimecoat and while that ammonia is high he needs his defences. Axolotls should only be handled if absolutley necessary such as if transferring from tank to treatment baths.

If there was a worm in it for me - I'd listen for your voice too! Perfectly normal.

Vicster1979 said:

We really want to add sand to the bottom of the tank, and get rid of the last few pebbles. Is this safe to do when he is still in the tank, or do we need to put him elsewhere while this is done? We got rid of nearly all of the pebbles at the same time of getting rid of the live plants in the hope that this would help the ammonia levels to drop. Also when we set up the tank we were worried about having a bare bottom on the tank as we had read that they find it hard to grip, so we used some rubber car mats which we put on the bottom. When water changes are done, we do lift them up and suck out the mess underneath, but could this be part of the cause of the water levels?

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I would take him out while making changes to the substrate - just put him in a tub of fresh dechlorinated water and leave it somewhere cool.

The sand will need to be rinsed thoroughly before being added to the tank. The best sand is Childrens play sand, fresh water aquarium sand or some people use pool filter sand. Do not use beach sand or marine sand.

If the plants are dying - this could be causing the ammonia levels to skyrocket. I don't use live plants myself, I use plastic plants as plants need light to survive, axies detest the light.

Don't use rubber car mats - these could be leaking toxins into the water - car mats are not designed to be kept immersed in water! Sand Substrate is the best option and is very easy to keep clean.

Bare bottom tank is even easier to keep clean but not as aesthetically pleasing.

Cheers Jacq.

I had a very similar problem recently where some plants had died and must of had a large root system which turned black under the sand and caused a nitrite and ammonia spike which made one of my Axies stop eating, swim around a lot and eventually die. The other one didn't show any changes at all.
The weird thing is that the one that died was some type of albino and the other is a wild type, just like yours were.
Is it possible that wild types can handle detrimental changes to water quality better than others? I had a friend who used to buy golden types only to have them die prematurely all the time (not to say he wasn't doing something else wrong) while his others survived.
Just a theory.

Thanks for the replies. Just to keep you up to date. We don't have any live plants in the tank now, only plastic ones, as previous advice suggested that these could be causing the problems.

We will get the rubber mats out. We just wanted them to have some grip on the bottom, and didn't want the pebbles touching the bottom in case of any cracks when they knocked them.

Obviously not many pebbles in there now so can't attact too much waste under them. We will do daily changes from now. Were just worried about doing this because of advice from other members worrying about too big water changes because of tank cycling, so were trying to keep it to a minimum.

Don't worry we haven't been stroking Stumpy, when he tried to nussle the tongs, we have moved them out of the way. We had read about the coating on their skin, so don't worry we are not constantly petting him, although due to his character we would love to! The only time he has been touched is when he was moved from his original pond, transported to our home, and placed in his new one.

Yes we are of the same opinion, are the wild types more resilient? Stumpy has been calmer being moved, has fed when offered, and is just generally more chilled. Ren was always more skittish, did try to attack Stumpy if he invaded his space, and was very fussy about food. Also spent a lot more time hiding out. Was also quite sweet as Stumpy seemed to be protective over Ren (who was slightly smaller than him). Also in the days leading up to Ren pasing away, Stumpy seemed to want to be around Ren more. Almost like he knew something was up.

We will keep you updated.

Latest update, ammonia levels still not 'level', but still working on it. Stumpy still doing fine though. He has picked up quite an appetite. Hope it's not a bad thing. He is refusing anything apart from trout at the moment (fresh/raw that is). He had 4 bits Wednesday. Normally he is not even up for seconds! His gills are not curled, so taking that as good. He is still swimming about a lot though, although is happy enough, even in the day, and in the light to chill out at the front of the tank. Will let you know if we ever crack the ammonia levels. Determined to get it right though. not even thinking about getting a friend for him until we're sorted. He seems happy enough, and is not squittish, so taking it all as good for the moment. Hope we're not wrong!

If you're cycling a tank with the animal in it, your first and foremost concern is providing the animal with an appropriate living environment. THEN you can be concerned about cycling.

Your tank will cycle eventually, even with daily water changes. It may take months, but without daily water changes, your animal will probably not survive that long.

Well guys. since my last post we have changed the tank base to a sand one.
getting rid of the rubber car mat base has totally saved the water levels. not a single problem so far. touch wood! Water readings are all spot on. Only problem now is that Stumpy has been very different personality wise. Thought he was going to go the same way as Ren, but progress tonight, our baby has eaten for the first time in 2 1/2 weeks. We have tried absolutely everything. He wouldn't touch his favourite trout which is seriously weird, worms, and slugs a no, as to trout pellets, but tonight he has had his first bit of trout. am so unbeliveably happy. He has had one small bit of trout. Fingers so tightly crossed that this is a sign of things to come. Any recommendations on anything else we can try? Have heard more than once about soft salmon pellets. Where do you get these from? Haven't seen them in any of our pet shops. Just worried as he is starting to act like Ren who sadly passed away; hanging out near the top of the tank a lot, and refusing his food. Is also really strange to see him walking along the sand. He always used to doggy paddle before! am hoping this means he likes the new sand and that it's not a bad sign. Any recommendations on types of fish that are nutricious to them?

Hi Vicster and congratulations!

You will more likely find salmon pellets at a feed store, not a pet shop. You can also order them from the internet.

Other types of foods are listed here: http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/foods.shtml
Nutritional values listed here: http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/foods2.shtml

Good luck to you both,

-Eva

Thanks very much, i will have a look at those links. Would be nice to try him on something new. Stumpy had 3 bits of trout on Sunday, so we are very pleased. He must have been stressed out with the move and new environment. He's starting to settle in now. Water levels still fine. His lively behaviour before must have been down to the nitrate, and ammonia levels, as he is very chilled out now. According to various posts this is normal. However I do miss his little adventures!

Glad to hear that Stumpy is doing better.

If you want to see him do aquatic tricks, sneak up in the middle of the night when he thinks nobody is looking. You might be surprised at what you see!

-Eva