Illness/Sickness: nasty white parasites in Spanish Ribbed Newt eyes

hey all

ive been trying to sort this for a while and my herp vet is at a loss. ive tried eye gels, couldnt get them to take oral worming treatment. any that i can give as a bath?

ive put them back in an aquatic setup in the hope of drowning the ones in the eyes. it makes the eye lids puff up and if i press against them with a wet tissue or cotton bud the white worm things can be forced out.

the vet thought maybe they start from the gut or somewhere...

any ideas....?

Sorry to hear that you are having trouble with P. Waltl (Spanish Ribbed newt).
I have not come across anything like it.
You say that you have put them back in an aquatic set-up - do you mean that more that one animal is affected by this condition and I'm assuming that they were originally in this "aquatic set-up" (they are a mainly aquatic species), and you took the opportunity to fully clean the tank/vivarium?
Can you kindly upload some photos. That will give others a better chance of helping you with this situation.

to be honest there is nothing to see, they look fine apart from slightly irratated eye lids.

there were in a terrestial set up with a swimming pool...newt sized of course. started using newspaper as substrate but that hasnt helped.

there are 5, the 3 smaller ones were affected, 2 more than the 3rd. the two larger newts so far dont seem to have the problem. eyes seem normal and not infected. though they 3 smaller ones are much smaller and after all this time i expected them to be bigger so something in the gut would seem likely.

First I would recommend moving the healthy newts into separate housing, and in my view should be housed in an aquatic environment. If you have to keep them terrestrial (vets advice?) stop using newspaper and go for kitchen roll. The newspaper will no doubt have all sorts of chemicals upon it, not to mention all the other things that can harm amphibians a skin.

They are also Europe's largest newt reaching approx 8 inches (20 CM) are they living in a cramped condition, what sizes are the newts?

Natural Range and Habitat:
Spanish ribbed newts are found throughout the Iberian Peninsula and Morocco. These regions are very arid and known for periodic droughts. Ribbed newts are almost entirely aquatic and prefer little or no current. They inhabit any standing water they can find, including ponds, lagoons, damns, and irrigation systems. If their water dries up, they will hide under rocks or in crevices, anywhere they can stay moist.


Housing:
The most suitable housing for ribbed newts is an aquarium, heavily planted, with a small floating land mass. Water level should be at 15 - 20 cm (6 - 8 in) outside of breeding season. It can be raised to higher water levels when breeding is desired. Gravel, if used, should be a size that will not be swallowed with food.
Temperatures are best kept below 21°C (72°F), as some animals become stressed at high temperatures (see information below about the effect of elevated temperature on eggs and larvae). This species encounters temperatures around freezing in the wild, so adults are able to tolerate cold.

The above was taken from http://www.caudata.org/cc/species/Pleurodeles/P_waltl.shtml


P. waltl in Captivity Pleurodeles waltl are very hardy in captivity, breeding regularly with little effort from their keepers. They can be considered one of the "indestructible" species. However, this does not mean they are impervious to problems if house improperly. Like all amphibians, P. waltl are susceptible to health problems and death from poor water quality, overcrowded conditions, mixed species tanks, etc. Pleurodeles waltl are large newts, capable of reaching up to 12 inches in total length, and averaging around 8-9 inches. P. waltl tend to nip at each other, and during feeding times can be blatantly violent. Because of their impressive size and voracious feeding habits, it is necessary to house these newts in large tanks with plenty of individual room. P. waltl are found at considerable depths in the wild, so a tall and wide tank is appropriate for this species.
Although P. waltl are tolerant of warmer temperatures for periods of time, the water temperature should be kept within the 68°F- 73°F range during the warmer months. During the winter months, temperatures of 55°F-63F° are acceptable.

The above was taken from http://www.livingunderworld.org/caudata/database/salamandridae/pleurodeles/waltl/

Hope this is of some use to you.

When you say that you couldn't get them to take the oral worming treatment... what method have you tried? There are ways to force-feed a newt. And also, Pleuros are such greedy eaters, that I suspect there must be a way to get the medicine into them through their food. If keeping them aquatic doesn't clear the problem, then I would reconsider some other ways to administer the meds. Good luck!

Are these the w.c. P. waltl that have recently popped up in the pet trade? I'd try grinding up some panacur (fenbendazole) tablets and putting in their water. Another treatment for worms that salamanders seem to tolerate is praziquantel in the tank water.

hmmm

some thoughts, some worming treatment in the water is what i was aiming for, so will check out those meds.

mine are odd little darlings and much prefer a dry set up with a large water bowl. the reason i moved them into that in the first place was due to stress and repeat escape attempts. they have always seemed happy enough since the change of housing. unlike now, where they are just trying to escape the water.

i got 2 from the pet trade, one was sold as an axolotl, the other was over heating and i felt sorry for it, the 3 little ones i got from someone on here.

as to food, they have a mix of crickets, worms, wax worms and sometimes bloodworm, but i dont want to overdose some and not others.

Get panacur paste and inject it into a waxworm. Feed the newts on land when you do this and make sure they swallow before you put them back in the water. The dosage is 50 mg per kg of newt. You should probably consult a vet before proceeding. This dosage has been prescribed by Frank Pasmans, a herp-savvy veterinarian who occasionally visits our site here.

Just thinking about this, if you do go my/Michael's prescribed route, it would be best to keep them on paper towelling (i.e. not in water) for at least 2 weeks, this should prevent reinfection and is a relatively sterile environment. In the mean time break the aquarium down and sterilise the bejeepers out of everything.

One last addendum about the panacur - the recommendation is to dose twice, about 10 days apart.

g_k said:

hey all

ive been trying to sort this for a while and my herp vet is at a loss. ive tried eye gels, couldnt get them to take oral worming treatment. any that i can give as a bath?

ive put them back in an aquatic setup in the hope of drowning the ones in the eyes. it makes the eye lids puff up and if i press against them with a wet tissue or cotton bud the white worm things can be forced out.

the vet thought maybe they start from the gut or somewhere...

any ideas....?

Click to expand...

What type of worm are you dealing with? That would help with treatment options.

If you are dealing with a trematode for example (not uncommon in amphibs) they have different life cycles/stages. If it is this, the free swimming larvae are found in water and would not drown and this form can enter the animal via skin penetration. These forms have been found in the eyes of amphibs and are visible to the naked eye.

Depending on what type of worm, where it exits in the body, what form (non-encysted) and the load, you may also need to be cautious of treatment producing an inflammatory reaction which can be fatal. Depending, treatment with a corticosteroid anti-inflammatory may be needed. I would definitely get back with your vet on this.

someone i know has suggested fish medication for fluke and such...bath them in it for about 10 mins

the problem is the vet has no idea and knows less about newts than me.

basicly they are white, about a mm wide at most and only 3-5mm long. ive cleaned the tank a couple of times now.

im going to have to find out what out of the treatments my vet can get as i think i may only be able to get the fluke stuff without any trouble.

thanks for all your help.