Illness/Sickness: I think their deathly sick

NewGuy1 · Feb 20, 2010

Im not really sure what to do. I just brought them home yesterday and they were finefor the first 6 hours. When I came home later that night they are both shedding and are hardly moving around. It seems like they are having trouble swimming because their movement seems strained. I dont think I was informed well enough when I bought them because something seems wrong. I have them in a 10 gallon tank with conditioned water, black gravel rocks at the bottom, I was told not to put a filter in their tank but that doesnt seem right. Now their skin that was shed is floating around the tank. I am going to change out the water at about 10-20% at a time so as not to startle them too much. Any help and advice will be greatly appreciated. I fell in love with them as soon as I got them home and it would be terrible if something happened to them.

bangadrum · Feb 20, 2010

What temperature is your tank?

Gravel is not ideal as they can ingest it while eating, and then if they don't pass it fully it can cause an impaction.

NewGuy1 · Feb 20, 2010

Im not sure of the temperature of the tank at the moment. The thermometer i have on the tank now has a lowest temperature of 64 degrees F and it is not regestering. What is the best replacement of the gravel so their food doesnt get stuck and out of their reach?

NewGuy1 · Feb 20, 2010

I am going to go to the pet store now and buy another thermometer with a lower range. I am also gonna get pebbles to lay in the bottom of the tank. When I return home I am also going to run a ph and amonia test on the water to check it. I have already repaced some of the water in the tank due to the fact that the tank is new and hopefully that will help. My biggest fear is that they will be startled too badly and get worse.

Shizeric · Feb 20, 2010

NewGuy1 said:
I dont think I was informed well enough when I bought them.

I think that is exactly the issue. Your tank is not large enough for 2 axolotls, does not appear to have any areas to hide in, and gravel or pebbles on the bottom can risk them accidentally ingesting the rocks which can cause impaction or eventual death. Conditioners are not wise to use with amphibians, as they are extremely sensitive to their water. Seeing that you said the tank is new..you missed a critical step of cycling the tank. Cycling ensures that ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels are appropriate for a healthy axolotl. If you are doing water changes, use water that has been set aside for at least 24-48 hours so the water has time to dechlorinate, or you can use spring water (deer park or poland springs).
I think your first step is going to have to be checking your water parameters (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate).

NewGuy1 · Feb 20, 2010

Just got home from the pet shop, got a fairly expensive test kit with a constant tester that tests for amonia and ph levels. Gonna go to get a 55 gallon tank here in the next few minutes and larger pebbles for the new tank.

melfly · Feb 20, 2010

If i were you i'd go with barebottomed tank or sand. Food and waste will accumilate in the gaps in the stones. As this will be a new tank you dont want to go messing up the water chemistry with stray food. Keep it simple while your still learning. You dont need a filter if your prepared to do frequent water testing and small changes. I would say once again for ease get a filter. Not too strong. Your doin the right thing being on here and asking advice. Yes you were ill informed and its always best to do your own independent research anyway. But your in the right place. Good luck. Mel
p.s if you have a light on in that tank turn it off, axolotls dont like light and need plenty of places to hide.

NewGuy1 · Feb 20, 2010

Went and bought a 55 gallon tank today. Have it set up and filled. Waiting for the water to sit a little bit before I move Scooter and Starla to their new home. Amonia level is at 0 and the pH level is at about an 8.2. Not sure where the pH level should be for a safe enviornment. Also what is the best temperature for their tank. I was told they like cold water but cold could be anything, lol. Filter is running in the new tank to help it cycle through faster before they get in there. My hopes over time is to be able to sustain their enviornment and possibly breed them for a hobby and to have more.

Kiwi303 · Feb 20, 2010

My advice is to go to Axolotls: The Fascinating Mexican Axolotl and the Tiger Salamander and read all the way through the headline pages, housing, requirements, and so on. it's a fairly simple site to navigate, and will bring you up to speed on the basics of what they need.

PH of 8.2 is too high, it should be low 7's. Cold means between 12 and 15 Celsius, through they will live between 10 and 18 without problems,

NewGuy1 · Feb 21, 2010

Thank you very much. I have been spending the past 15 hours researching and going to the store and tending to the tanks. I never thought I would get attached to anything so fast but these guys were family before I even realized it. Any extra sources of information are greatly appreciated.:happy:

melfly · Feb 21, 2010

Cycling a tank can take up to 6-8 weeks and needs an ammonia source to start. If you cycle with your axolotls in you need to be very careful of the water quality and do small frequent water changes. Good luck. Mel

NewGuy1 · Feb 21, 2010

I plan on doing water changes of about 25-20% a day right after I check all the chemical levels. Scooter seems to be doing better but Starla from what I found online is not doing so good due to the temperature reaching 74 F. Her gills were pointed forward so instead of putting her directly into the larger tank I got water from the 10 gallon tank she was in previously and stuck her in the fridge. I figure that way she isnt going from such a warm temperature to the cooler water all at once. My only problem is I cant find a way to stop the tanks from getting so hot. I do not have the heat on in my house so the tanks work their way to room temperature. I read that i could freeze a bottle of water and float is to try and help the temperature stay cool. Any suggestions for a more permenant solution because the summer is coming up soon.

Dean · Feb 21, 2010

From what I can gather the only other thing to do is buy a water chiller but from what I gather they are rather expensive -
My son is the one with the axies and we have a similar problem with the water temp - but we have gotten into a good routine of frozen water bottles and ice cubes - rotating bottles between three freezers - we try to take them out when they are about half melted so there isn't such a sudden change in temp - add a new one - and start the rotations of the freezer - we also add ice cubes during the the middle of the day - the only other thing I can suggest from my reading and please anyone correct if I am wrong (we are new to the axie world too) - make sure the tank is away from sun light - so it wont heat as much - sorry I can't offer any more advice - I am sure someone that knows alot more than me will offer you some as well - the people on here are great - they have been a massive help to me and my son - goodluck with them
Kerry (Dean's mum)

melfly · Feb 21, 2010

I agree with kerrys (dean) post. The only way without doing ice bottle changes is a chiller. I'm in the uk and i was struggling with the temp in our summer so i can imagine its a nightmare over there. The only other thing is to keep them in the fridge throughout the summer. I think you've done the right think putting the axie in the fridge but if the temp is 74 i would put the other one in too. Mel

Dean · Feb 21, 2010

we are in QLD Australia and our days have been up around the 33 - 35 C mark - that is 93.2 F - gee never realised how that converted - arhhhh - anyway Freddy is still in his tank in my sons room and is well - so the water bottles must work - When we are out for the day I add the ice packs that are designed for athletes - I tie them around a frozen smaller bottle and wedge it in the corner of the tank near the hidy log - and a two litre water bottle frozen we have also frozen water in plastic cups and put the ice from that in the tank - they freeze quicker than two litre bottles - we hit a temp of 37.8 C the aboout 6 days ago that is 100.04 F (have convertor on my mobile) - and Freddy - got through that - he is in the darkest corner of my sons room and not near an out side wall - It just means that there is alot of work but once the rotation is set up it isn't that bad - Kerry - we are quite used to it now - LOL -

lea · Feb 21, 2010

hi newguy1

i had the same problem with the temp, i live in qld as well and we had a esky(chiller for drinks that you at ice too) filled with ice and then we got some extra hose and ran it thought the ice and that worked really well( we had to add ice morning and night) so it soon added up but now we have a freezer next to the tank with the hose running though that (it isnt perfect but it works ok) but we still add frozen bottles morning and night.............

lea

Kaysie · Feb 22, 2010

Based on your pictures... and your location, I suspect you have tiger salamander larvae, and not axolotls.

NewGuy1 · Feb 23, 2010

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who told me to remove the gravel from my tank. I have it bare bottom for now with some plants culturing in another tank (Scooter tries to eat the bulbs so their seperated for now). My friend who bought his at the same time as I did is in some trouble. He called me to come check on them for him because he didnt know what to do. When I got there the first thing I noticed was that one of them had a buldge half the side of its head on its back. Turns out he didnt listen to me in time and both his male and female have been eating gravel. I had him fridge both in seperate tanks and just within the 8 hours the female has already spit up 6 smaller gravel rocks. I have yet to hear about the male. Once again I just wanted to give a big thank you to everyone who helped prevent this from happening to my babies. :happy:

shoegal · Mar 4, 2010

74 degrees is way too warm for axies (if that is what you actually have). I keep mine at 64 degrees (with the help of a Novateq mini chiller which cost $170), and they are happy as clams and have never gotten sick. Warm temperatures for extended periods of time can cause very serious issues for axies.

Regarding filters, I would HIGHLY recommend getting a filter. Axies can be messy creatures and a filter will reduce the work load for you. I have a canister filter on my 30 gallon tank, and it keeps the water crystal clear.

One last note... I have never heard of axies shedding. I found that comment pretty disturbing. However, maybe what you have is not an axie.

Illness/Sickness: I think their deathly sick

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