Illness/Sickness: Possibly urgent, any help appreciated.

Background:
New axolotl, Snorkel. Been with me about three weeks, there's seemingly no problem with her old tank mates from where she was before. Has been eating perfectly fine (until now) no out of the ordinary behaviour other than being overly active within the first week ( I put this down to the stress of being moved, no other signs of stress). She's still in the quarantine tank, cycled 20 gallon, hides and foliage (all fake), sand substrate (cleaned with plain water 1 inch thick), In a place that's hit sometimes by natural light, no lighting used. Gills and normal wounds (pet shop tank mate attacks) have been improving and healing well - decent water quality. Temp at 16C

Condition: Floating almost lifeless (had to pay very special attention to movement to find life) gill are fairly red, especially for an axolotl who isn't being overly active. No noticeable swelling, or any other physical problems.
Possible causes: Everything has been ordinary, swallowed an entire cube of frozen blood worms the other day, possible problem? Found some that may have been regurgitated an hour or so later (cleaned them out) all poos have been normal axolotl pelletplops.

I did a 20% water change (I was supposed to today anyway) she also will not take food (at least atm, I offered live earthworm) I'm really unsure what the problem and cause are. I would greatly appreciate any insight you might have, this forum has helped me through every problem I've had with my squishies before and I love you guys, I know here is the best place to come to, to help my babies.

I will try to feed her again very soon, and keep checking/updating her condition. So much stress >.< Everyone else is perfectly fine - the tanks I tend to keep around the same and there's no problems in the main one. If there's any additional information needed i'll do my best to provide it, i think I just about covered everything though.

Thanks again in advance.

Is it different from the 'lazy float'? Is she having trouble submerging?

Kaysie said:

Is it different from the 'lazy float'? Is she having trouble submerging?

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much different, she's on her side now with her mouth hanging open slightly, There's no movement at all from her now, I don't know if she's having trouble submerge properly because I haven't seen her try. I really think she's on her way out I don't even know why.

earlier I watched her for about five minutes, there was only ONE movement from her, she opened her mouth very wide and then shut it again, i'm assuming there is air trapped in her but i don't think that's the only problem here :/

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I would have already thought she was dead if her gills weren't still quite red, and i know axolotls can appear dead quite QUITE well >.<

I just took some photos.



Ok, this is new:

she's as picture still as she is in these:


I feel so irresponsible that I don't know what's happening >.< I just hate that she wont move, I don't know if she's dead or not.
I'm just so frustrated, snorkel was healing so well, and so close to meeting the other guys. I really thought she was top notch healthy, all the bits were growing back etc etc. I'm holding out hope.

Update:

All the colour has gone from snorkel's gills I think i'm done. I can't cope with the pain of losing anymore gorgeous babies. I'll still of course continue to look after and love nana and ronnie, but I don't think i'll be getting any more axolotls again, this will be two i've lost (i'm pretty sure she's gone) and with this beig so close that it's obviously something i've done, or not done, and not even knowing why. I thnk maybe i'm too irresponsible? I don't know >.< i wish i'd have left her where she was, she'd have been in a shop with those nasty bright lights but she'd be alive i think.

I'm sorry for putting this on you guys.

I'm so sorry for you There's nothing worse than feeling like you've failed the ones that depend on you. I'm feeling the exact same way and I haven't even lost one yet. It's one of the worst feelings. I hope that something better comes your way today.

I feel evil, it's horrible.If anyone can see something I can't that could be why this has happened could you please offer your opinion? I don't want to hurt my other guys, I don't know what i'd do if they died. I feel so irresponsible for not knowing what's happening/happened.

is it just me or does there appear to be some blood spots in the groin area and a lump/wart/cyst on the back leg? i'm no expert so these are just things that look abnormal.

LeFarge said:

is it just me or does there appear to be some blood spots in the groin area and a lump/wart/cyst on the back leg? i'm no expert so these are just things that look abnormal.

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that's the "new thing, I was referring too they look like a small cluster of lumps/cysts some of which have reddish-brown spots some of which don't. The axolotl itself was/is quite 'bumpy' the lump on the back leg is kind of a keloid type deal, which I gathered is from an old tank mate attack, it's been there for a long time as far as I can tell. the groin area is definitely new. The colouration disturbs me.

I wish my camera was better but it's not so i'll try to describe them more accurately.
They're small lumps not dissimilar to hair follicles, some are the same colour as the axolotl's skin, some have those darker spots on parts of them.

Crysta dont beat yourself up darling. You are a good mumma to your axies. Sometimes life does things to us that we will never understand. Im sorry for your loss.
Wipe your eyes, have a glass of wine and get ready to say goodbye to your axie, that YOU gave 3 happy weeks of love, care and yummy worms too. YOU showed him/her how a axie should be treated.
Chin up lovely.

Crysta,

Please don't beat yourself up about it. You've not been in the slightest bit irresponsible - it looks like Snorkel has become a product of what happens when pet stores do not know every single specialist detail about every single pet. In shops where the staff are on minimum wages and so many breeds often turn from random breeders with excess stock, it must be difficult to invest the time in researching them and trawling each forum to know everything about their care as we do when we keep them for a hobby. I feel so much for you - it's so easy to fall in love with a pet, even more so when it's poorly and you just want to nurture it. I hope it's not passed and that it's not too late, but if it has, I'm so sorry for your loss and you must feel exhausted from the love and care you have given it. Know that it has been happier in your quarantine tank than it has in the pet shop and enjoyed having the same smiling face looking at it each day.

As for the cause - it looks to have a massive irritation just up from the groin, not to mention those cysts. It's likely that the irritation was in his groin, possibly from a parasite, maybe even impaction - and to relieve himself he had been trying to scratch himself on rocks or hides or plants or whatever. It's obvious that whatever was causing that irritation was making him sick, probably affecting his swim bladder, hence the floating.
I have just discovered the joys of almond leaves - with any new amphibious chum I will quarantine them with one of those to combat any possible fungus from their old life.
It's very important to check irregular things (like those lumps, and that horrible irritation) out as soon as you notice it, and you should be noticing them in a quarantine tank so you do not introduce anything terrible to your other pets. You will always find good advice on these forums - even if the advice is 'this issue is beyond us, seek a vet immediately' then it is still better than leaving it to see what happens. It's possible he could have been saved by some medication - but either way, it's so important to mention this to your pet shop. Not to try and get a refund as it's unlikely - but so they can keep a closer eye on the other axies and adjust how they are keeping them. It's possible the ill-informed shop was just feeding them dead fish from the other tanks - that's was my scrawny first axie was living on before we found eachother. Perhaps they were treating the water with an unsuitable product. Either way, it would be great to pop in and have a chat. That would be a responsible thing to do

I hope some of that helps you, or anyone else that reads this, and apart from that I hope that you aren't sad for too long. Keep your chin up xx

xC

lea said:

Crysta dont beat yourself up darling. You are a good mumma to your axies. Sometimes life does things to us that we will never understand. Im sorry for your loss.
Wipe your eyes, have a glass of wine and get ready to say goodbye to your axie, that YOU gave 3 happy weeks of love, care and yummy worms too. YOU showed him/her how a axie should be treated.
Chin up lovely.

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Leanne I love that you managed to say everything I was trying to say in much fewer sentences.I really need to get on hold on my rambling!!

'Don't beat yourself up about it' and 'chin up' - snap x

The only thing worse than feeling clueless and helpless is the guilt that maybe we aren't doing all we can for them. Even if things don't work out, you still gave it the attention and care it deserved. It's far better for it to pass away in a loving home where you've done all you can than where it'll just be tossed out.

A big issue with these neglected creatures is that the lack of care can leave them weak and vulnerable to even the most mundane problems. This weakness can take a long time to overcome, and sometimes it's just too much for them to recover from. Even with the best care, sometimes it's just not going to happen.

Closely examining the photos, it looks like cysts are elsewhere on the Axie's skin. This could indicate something viral, bacterial or even parasitic that is going on. It could be something that it simply is too weak to fight. Sometimes all you can do is supportive care and hope you can strengthen their immune systems, especially if the specific treatment for the illness may actually do more harm and irritation.

I'm not a veterinary expert, but these are just some hunches I have from experience with a variety of animals.

I do wish you the best. Like I said, you've given this animal the love and attention it deserved and that makes all the difference. Some things are out of our hands, and we have to accept that. You may want to prepare a way to euthanize it, just in case. It's hard to make the decision to keep trying or to let go.

I just remember last night she was staring at me when i was going to sleep, and thinking to myself that she must be starting to grow fond of me, she was probably screaming for help. I'll be fine guys, thank you so much.

I will say one thing for sure, no more animals of any type from shops, even when I know the 'lotls are from reputable breeders I can't know how well every member of staff cares for anything. The uncertainty hurts, i'll try and contact my dubbed "best vet" at an acceptable time (it's 00:57) by then i'm certain i'll know for sure.

I'll go to the shop too later, anything I can do to warn/make aware and prevent any other lots getting hurt I'll try. I wouldn't say the place is ill-informed, I do hold some of the staff in high regard, but yeah - I can't vouch for everyone, or know what happens all the time and I can safely assume they don't monitor lotl behavior/condition everyday, and then you've got the whole lighting thing they do, the cheep feeding methods and the 'tapping glass' people. I'm almost happy that this is now and not a week later when "quarantine time" would have been over.
Thank you guys, i'm going to have that glass of wine now lol.

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I do love this forum, everyone has the best advice. I really do feel a lot better now at least compared to earlier. I've thought about it and I know that I try my best to love my lots and spoil them rotten with all the best that I can get them, so I'm going to work on not beating myself up about this. Just carry on doing the best I can.

from your responses I can agree there's definitely irritation in those angry bumps around the groin, thinking back I don't remember any odd behavior other than more "swimming" as opposed to walking at least within the first two weeks.

Crysta,
If the baby is really just clinging on, maybe you should consider letting her live out her last hours in the fridge. It's called 'Axolotl Sanctuary' for good reason - at least she will be on the floor without floating and will be in lovely cool water, she can't ask for better than that in her last moments.

xxC

Any update lovely??
xC

She passed away sometime in that night, while she was in he fridge. Fortunately it doesn't look like she was in much stress, all the usual tell tale signs weren't there. This just happened really fast, earlier in the day she was perfectly fine >.<

I'm sorry to hear of it's passing, but it passed in a loving home and that's very important. I hope you have better luck in the future! At least it's mysterious suffering is at an end.

**** honey I'm sorry.
You gave it your best shot and the baby lived the best it could have.

Hope you're ok x