willowcat
New member
If you are wanting to build a box, add a decoration, or anything else that is going to come into contact with water that you consume or the water that is in contact with your animals, well, best to do your homework. I hope that I can save you a few steps on a path of mental torment. I just went through it, and wish this on no one. I am going to tell my story and I will try to keep it short (won't happen). If you want to skip the story and go to the link, it is the next paragraph.>>> I needed to line wood boxes that I planned to use in my business for various animal holdings, that need to be water tight. The first material that I purchase was F.R.P.--Fiberglass Reinforced Panels---, with aquarium approved silicone.
Made a box, lined it, and developed a leak. My carpenter buddy suggested Fiberglass Resin without the cloth. So I called the 800 number and asked them if it was okay for me to use this material for this type of application. They said yes. 4 gallons OS Resin later, I learned that maybe the answer should of been a no. I thoroughly read the directions on the can 4,1089 times. Unbelievable. The directions are extremely poor. They explain things in drops! 10 drops. What in the world is a drop? (please don't answer that) So I looked at the amount that was in the can and the amount in the ----hardener tube-----, did a conversion, on line, from metric into the ole' English system. (thank God that Benjamin Franklin said no to the English system of measurement for our monetary system!!!) Can you imagine counting out 33 and a 1/3 cents? Or saying to someone "you owe me 1/8 of a dollar!! Anyway, I had it all figured out. My first application of Fiberglass Resin returned a tacky box. I called the company and they said "not enough hardener". So I go to the store and buy extra little tubes of hardener. The rest of boxes I add "extra" hardener. Worked great!!!!! I started doing web searches on the effects of cured resigns on amphibians, because I started hearing the BPA plastic scare that our media and politicians are trying to stir up. Yes, I know plastics are a problem, but the way it is reported is like listening to the global warming crowd. (don't e-mail me about this). So I come across a lot of info. This one, is the one that got me.--I will cut and paste.
Here it is>>>>>>>>>> epoxy is less likely to adversely affect the physical properties of cured epoxy than excess hardener. When excess hardener is in the epoxy matrix, it cannot fully react with the resin and will become suspended in the mixture. Because amines (in the hardeners) are water soluble, they can potentially leach out and cause odd tastes, contaminates in the liquid, and porosity in the epoxy film, among other performance defects.<<<<<<<<<<<< ---------so I called the company and they denied that they gave an okay for my application. (it was the same guy that I talked to originally). Can't fight them.---They have more money than I do. So, he gave me a number for the toxicology Dept. which led me to a Veterinarian. The Vet. wanted to know the chemical makeup on the hardener. Called the company back and they would tell me nothing, except names of two chemical companies and told me to look the phone numbers up myself.---I actually held my cool--- The two chemical companies led me down a narrow road. After a few u-turns and lots of bumps, I ended up at the N.S.F.--National Sanitation Foundation. So if you want to know what is safe this is where to start. Know this---they only test what companies pay them to test. The testing is made for human beings, not animals. But, this is what we have. The contact personal was extremely helpful with guideing me thru the National Sanitation Foundation web site. Once she got me where I needed to be, she told me what to look for.
Here it is. NOTE: If you buy anything that is manufactured sytenthicly with chemicals or are chemicals themselves, and want to know if they have been approved for the humans, look for the N.S.F approval on the product. Of you are not sure, here is where you go for the information. Many avenues in their web-site. I am going to walk you through what she walked me through.
Type--www.nsf.org once on home page---look at top right corner--orange box that has written on it "SEARCH CERTIFIED PRODUCTS AND SYSTEMS"---click on that----8th paragraph, where it says "DRINKING WATER SYSTEMS COMPONENTS"---click on that---5 down it says----"PRODUCT TYPES"---go to the end with the little blue down arrow---click on that----scroll down to "COATINGS-TANKS"- click on that--go down to the "SEARCH" box and click that---see the different paragraphs? We want the second one---206N----Here is why---see where it says--- "WATER CONTACT SIZE RESTRICTIONS"----"WATER CONTACT TEMP".----and----"WATER CONTACT MATERIALS"---that is your info. Those numbers are tighter than the paragraph above. Notice it is also not an epoxy. So the results for potable water is better. If you want to know what they mean then call the N.S.F. They are very helpful.
I hope this helps........
Trace
,
Made a box, lined it, and developed a leak. My carpenter buddy suggested Fiberglass Resin without the cloth. So I called the 800 number and asked them if it was okay for me to use this material for this type of application. They said yes. 4 gallons OS Resin later, I learned that maybe the answer should of been a no. I thoroughly read the directions on the can 4,1089 times. Unbelievable. The directions are extremely poor. They explain things in drops! 10 drops. What in the world is a drop? (please don't answer that) So I looked at the amount that was in the can and the amount in the ----hardener tube-----, did a conversion, on line, from metric into the ole' English system. (thank God that Benjamin Franklin said no to the English system of measurement for our monetary system!!!) Can you imagine counting out 33 and a 1/3 cents? Or saying to someone "you owe me 1/8 of a dollar!! Anyway, I had it all figured out. My first application of Fiberglass Resin returned a tacky box. I called the company and they said "not enough hardener". So I go to the store and buy extra little tubes of hardener. The rest of boxes I add "extra" hardener. Worked great!!!!! I started doing web searches on the effects of cured resigns on amphibians, because I started hearing the BPA plastic scare that our media and politicians are trying to stir up. Yes, I know plastics are a problem, but the way it is reported is like listening to the global warming crowd. (don't e-mail me about this). So I come across a lot of info. This one, is the one that got me.--I will cut and paste.
Here it is>>>>>>>>>> epoxy is less likely to adversely affect the physical properties of cured epoxy than excess hardener. When excess hardener is in the epoxy matrix, it cannot fully react with the resin and will become suspended in the mixture. Because amines (in the hardeners) are water soluble, they can potentially leach out and cause odd tastes, contaminates in the liquid, and porosity in the epoxy film, among other performance defects.<<<<<<<<<<<< ---------so I called the company and they denied that they gave an okay for my application. (it was the same guy that I talked to originally). Can't fight them.---They have more money than I do. So, he gave me a number for the toxicology Dept. which led me to a Veterinarian. The Vet. wanted to know the chemical makeup on the hardener. Called the company back and they would tell me nothing, except names of two chemical companies and told me to look the phone numbers up myself.---I actually held my cool--- The two chemical companies led me down a narrow road. After a few u-turns and lots of bumps, I ended up at the N.S.F.--National Sanitation Foundation. So if you want to know what is safe this is where to start. Know this---they only test what companies pay them to test. The testing is made for human beings, not animals. But, this is what we have. The contact personal was extremely helpful with guideing me thru the National Sanitation Foundation web site. Once she got me where I needed to be, she told me what to look for.
Here it is. NOTE: If you buy anything that is manufactured sytenthicly with chemicals or are chemicals themselves, and want to know if they have been approved for the humans, look for the N.S.F approval on the product. Of you are not sure, here is where you go for the information. Many avenues in their web-site. I am going to walk you through what she walked me through.
Type--www.nsf.org once on home page---look at top right corner--orange box that has written on it "SEARCH CERTIFIED PRODUCTS AND SYSTEMS"---click on that----8th paragraph, where it says "DRINKING WATER SYSTEMS COMPONENTS"---click on that---5 down it says----"PRODUCT TYPES"---go to the end with the little blue down arrow---click on that----scroll down to "COATINGS-TANKS"- click on that--go down to the "SEARCH" box and click that---see the different paragraphs? We want the second one---206N----Here is why---see where it says--- "WATER CONTACT SIZE RESTRICTIONS"----"WATER CONTACT TEMP".----and----"WATER CONTACT MATERIALS"---that is your info. Those numbers are tighter than the paragraph above. Notice it is also not an epoxy. So the results for potable water is better. If you want to know what they mean then call the N.S.F. They are very helpful.
I hope this helps........
Trace
,