Blood in water...

My female laid eggs at the beginning of February, all seemed to be well (I gave the eggs to a professor...). She was eating, and everything seemed to be normal. about a week ago she stopped eating. I test the water weekly, I have a chiller, and external eheim filter....water is 'perfect'. I even brought some to have it tested elsewhere. Thinking she was not well, I separated her and 'floated' her in the aquarium in her own 'tub'. Today, I checked on her and the water was bloody, and there was a 'mass' in the water. She seems 'pale' to me -- she is an albino to begin with, but she doesn't look good. I have no idea what could possibly be wrong with her, and I am just sick about this. The male is fine, eating voraciously, not a problem. Any ideas welcome please...I have attached pictures of the 'mass' and her....

If she is pale and has been bleeding, she could be anaemic. I am not too sure what that mass is though. I know there are many other members here that have more experience with breeding axolotls who may have more of an idea of what might be going on.

I think this could warrant a vet visit. Do you have a herp vet anywhere near you?

there is a vet that I use for my reps -- does not handle axolotls -- but may try anyway tomorrow....I don't have any substrate other than slate slabs....and one small driftwood log (to handle the pH). I also have 5 small tetra from when I was trying to cycle the tank -- it does appear that I am getting some 'debris', thinking it is bacteria from hoses. This tank is somewhat established from January...again the levels for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH are 'perfect' (I use API)....I even brought water yesterday to fish store to triple check.... I feed them earthworms, and NEVER leave food in the tank. I am sick over this!
There are absolutely no cuts or trauma -- and actually - she has been in a plastic tub for a few days, so this is really even more odd....

female still hanging in there -- but she looks horrible. Off to vet to see what he thinks....perhaps an antibacterial or anti-fungal med?? Please send positive thoughts our way. She is very special to me, and I absolutely can't think of why this is happening...I don't think it looks good for her....

vet took look, and x-ray - no obstructions....nothing of note. Thinks something may have ruptured -- why -- not known. Gave her shot of tazicef, and a calcium supplement..I don't think either of us has a lot of hope, but I can't just sit by and do nothing. Perhaps she had a compromised immune system from the laying of eggs. This is just very sad. If anyone has any ideas, I would like to hear please.

It does sound possible it could be a complication from laying eggs. If something has ruptured I am not sure what can be done. It is sad but sometimes these things just happen.

Could you confirm what your actual water parameter readings are for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?

ammonia, nitrate and nitrite are zero -- not even a question....pH fine. Had water tested to confirm what my API kit showed because I was so worried. Truly, if that was even a concern, I wouldn't be reaching out so desperately as I am right now to the DB. I would be grateful for any advice -- anything that would give her a chance.

The other issue is I have no idea how old this axolotl is -- I have had her about a year, but she came from a professor that does research. The vet noticed that she has calcium loss in limbs, and had given me a supplement to use....which I have given her along with the antibiotic.

Today her tail is obviously curled. She is still extremely pale. I have her in her own 'tub' and that tub floating in the chilled aquarium, which I keep at 65 degrees. I have been changing her water in the tub daily for the past week with dechlorinated water, and trying to keep her 'comfortable'.

She has no interest in eating, and I have tried to put a portion of earthworm in her mouth, but she'll have none of it. I don't know that she will be able to recover.

Male in aquarium and doing fine.

Are they the readings for the actual aquarium or the tub the sick axolotl is in? No nitrate at all suggests the tank is not cycled?

If something has ruptured and she is not improving, I am not sure there is much you can do. If the treatments offered by the vet are not working and it is looking unlikely she is going to make it, euthanasia might be the kindest option. However I think this is beyond my knowledge and other members may have something to contribute. I am sorry I cannot help much further.

I wouldnt be too hasty to euthanize. You said she looks "horrible", have you any pics. If you're keeping her at 65f and its lower than her usual temp she will look paler than usual especially as she is inactive. Axolotls have good re-generational abilities, she may sort herself out from what ever the problem is, her body mass is ok so she can survive quite a while without feeding.

No, I will not euthanize...she is still hanging in there, and we will continue with vet visits. I have attached pictures. I am going to be cautiously optimistic....she actually looks better today. I called vet, and expect he will call tomorrow, and see what treatment we can continue. Her gills are at least pink. I keep the water temp at 65-66, so this is not a new temp for her. I have a chiller, so that is consistent. I feel better that you think she may be able to go a while without eating....she has always had a 'hearty' appetite, so a little on the 'heavy' side, so I hope that will bode well for her in this situation. I feed then earthworms -- always wash them first, and NEVER leave food in the tank -- if they don't eat, I try later! Back to the water -- the tests I have done are of course for the aquarium, not the tub.

I teach high school -- AP Biology and Honors biology, and the axolotls are important to me -- I am aware of their incredible ability for regeneration! They are wonderful ambassadors and I teach students about not only this miraculous regenerative trait, but also that the exhibit paedomorphosis. I always talk about them when we talk about evolution, and the 'why' they may have retained their external gills. They are the talk of the school, especially when she laid the eggs. Her name is 'Wallace' (Wallie for short), and her mate of course, is Darwin. I too am hoping that the regenerative properties will help her heal...and a little isolation and rest may help....

I will be devastated if I lose her --and I will try anything to help her out....all advice welcome

That is great she has made some improvement. If she is improving then certainly keep going with her and keep doing what you are doing.

I am hoping the antibiotics are helping...will know more tomorrow. Hope she keeps fighting!

Based on the background history. It is unlikely to do with husbandry. I am not convinced it will be an environmental/tank water issue. As the axie's tankmate is doing well, i would suspect the issue will be specific to this female axie only and not anything transmissible.

One area worth looking into is the dissolved salt content in the water. If you have very soft water, you may like to consider increasing its hardness slightly. Soft water can cause a transient anaemia, and this would be more apparent in animals with higher physiological burden (ie gravid). Axolotls - Requirements & Water Conditions in Captivity

Without actually physically examining the animal and the mass, it is difficult to provide a differential diagnosis. It can be anything ranging from poorly digested ingesta, external contaminant (something dropped into the tank water), to sloughing of the intestinal tract. Therefore, even if it is something from the axie, we have to determine from which end it came out of. Regurgitation could result in partially digested ingesta taking on a bizarre appearance. If it came out from the other end, it is worthwhile to perhaps have a look at the material under microscope to deduce the tissue type which can provide clues to the pathology.

Nonetheless, the focus should now be on supporting the axolotl and constant monitoring. As long as she is on the mend and improving, prognosis should be good.

On another note, gravid animals can assimilate their nutrients in a different way, preferentially using nutrients and bodily reserves to egg formation. In these cases, some animals can actually use up any fat/calcium (ie resorption) in bodily stores or even from own skeleton to make up for any deficit. Normally after this period, the animal will regain its body condition again.

Hope this helps.

Thank you Doctor for your kindness in replying and your thoughts. It is with an extremely heavy heart that I have to say she died this morning. I am just miserable.

I took the bloody mass to my vet Monday, and I do believe that is why he was thinking 'rupture'. I am not sure we will know which end, but it did not appear to be an obvious regurgitated mass, it appeared more like 'tissue'. Again, no obstructions noticed via x-ray. He did notice the calcium loss, and thought the reason was because of her recent event, which is why he gave me the calcium supplement along with the antibiotic. We tried to save her...

Our water here is actually a bit hard, but I will see what I can do to measure the dissolved salt content, for her tank-mate.

I am devastated at her loss....and if I even thought this would be so harmful to her, I would have not allowed the mating, assuming that played a significant role in her death. Her tank-mate is thriving and doing well, eating just fine.

The saddest part of all of this is that I don't even have any of her offspring -- I gave them away. Never thought I could get so attached to an amphibian, but here we are.

This is a very sad day indeed...

I am sorry to hear she did not make it

Thank you so much for your kind words and input -- it truly meant a great deal! It really helps to get opinions and comments when trying to troubleshoot. I will follow up with the vet today, and see if there is any way that we can determine what went wrong. She will be missed....

You are welcome, though I wish I could have helped you more. Hopefully the vet can give you some idea of what may have happened.

It might be irrelevant, but in humans pregnancy can cause bone loss and anemia when the baby takes calcium from the bones and iron from the blood.

Somebody at an aquarium suggested to me putting lace rock in my tank to increase minerals in the water. I know that axolotls are naturally "beggars" but if they are excessively hungry and fat it could be a sign of nutritional deficiencies.

Of course, I'm not blaming you, only offering information. I'm sorry for your loss.

so so sorry for your Loss