Newbie with a few questions

Hi all, I am new here and to salamanders, but have kept reptiles for a long time. About a week ago my roommate found a small salamander almost frozen as it was crossing the road (it was only in the 40's). Instead of leaving it and letting it get run over, he brought it home and now I am caring for it. I am now looking for advice from all of you. I have done a good deal of research and I think I have things setup well for him, but would like your input.

Also, If anyone can tell me what kind of salamander he is, I would appreciate it. I think he is a western tiger salamander, but cannot be sure.

Some info that may help:

Location - Denver, Colorado
Tank - 18x18x24 Exo Terra terrarium
Lights - Custom built LED fixture
Substrate - Eco Earth coconut husk fiber approximately 3 inches deep
Food - Gut loaded crickets and Dubia Roaches (I Breed chameleons)
Water - I spray the terrarium at least daily and he has a large, in ground, water bowl

For the first few days he buried himself in the substrate and NEVER showed himself. For a couple of days after that he formed a small hole and stayed inside it with just his head visible. Finally, yesterday he had most of his body out of his hole for most of the day, and then came out completely last night and was still out this morning when I left for work.

Here are some pictures of him ad his new home. Any comments or suggestions are welcomed.

This is from when my roommate found him


These are from this morning





And finally his home

Personally I would buy a different tank, whether used or new, one that has no fancy doors, and more of a footprint, ideally there should be at least 4" of substrate, I like to keep mine in a plastic storage bin, with a slope of 4" to 8". Also try to keep the temp below 70F, and the waterbowl should be large and deep enough for it to completely submerge itself. Also, if kept cool, don't be worried if it stays underground for long periods of time, it should come up eventually to feed, usually when its dark, so at night time.

For for I would switch off of crickets personally, uneaten crickets will bite the salamander and they aren't very good nutritionally. I would feed nightcrawler/earthworm as a staple, usually I can get mine to eat medium sized whole ones or large cut in half ones. To feed starting out I put the worms in a nonmetal dog bowl, and, misted the tank, left it alone and eventually the salamander would come out and eat it. Now that its more tame, its usually on the surface when its hungry, and I can just drop the worm into the tank near the salamander and it will eat it.

I would give him deeper soil, a few more inches maybe, they like to burrow in the ground ( that is where they spend most of their time ).
I too would take crickets out of his diet and add earthworms or nightcrawlers instead. They are very good nutritionally, and are usually a favorite food.
I don't think it is necessary to spray that much. Too much moisture with this species can cause problems.
I don't see any problems with the doors, as long as he cant escape through them. The soil should be deeper, and you should mist less, but other than that the setup looks pretty good. Another hide might be good as well.

And by the way, 40 degrees is not going to harm this guy. On the other hand, you want to keep it below 70, like Aaron said.

Hope this helps and good luck! -Seth

that looks exactly like my tiger salamander nice tank set up... is he easy to take care of or does he try to get out of the cage cause he is wild? i got mine from an egg i found in my forest and he doesn't even know the difference i would send a pic of him but i don't know how to send picks any way of telling me how to? thx

seth

i would suggest not feeding a salamander earth worms cause they don't digest properly i personally would choose CRICKETS as i do for my tiger salamander as he is not an axolotl

What makes worms hard to digest? Do you have any info supporting that? One would think that it would be the other way around, that, since crickets have a exoskeleton, and are harder, they would actually be harder to digest than worms, which are soft.
No, a tiger salamander isn't a axolotl, but they are very closely related, and can be fed the same, even though one is aquatic and the other isn't. And most people feed axolotls worms.

Besides that, worms are better nutritionally. Their calcium to phosphorus ratio is much better. Here is a link that shows the nutrition of some amphibian foods. Caudata Culture Articles - Nutritional Values

And here is how to post pictures. http://www.caudata.org/forum/f1173-...to-video-gallery/94336-how-post-pictures.html -Seth

Re: seth

hydro said:

i would suggest not feeding a salamander earth worms cause they don't digest properly i personally would choose CRICKETS as i do for my tiger salamander as he is not an axolotl

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I think you're thinking of mealworms and superworms, which have hard exoskeletons which are hard to digest and aren't very nutritional anyways. Earthworm and Nightcrawler is usually considered the best staple diet for caudates, they digest it fine, and its pretty nutritional.

And since it was found in colorado, and based on some of those markings, I believe it is a Barred Tiger Salamand, Ambystoma mavortium mavortium.

Thank you all for your thoughts and suggestions. I will add more soil this evening when I get home. As for getting him a new cage, I am afraid he will have to deal with this one fro a while. I already had this laying around, and do not plan on buying anything else any time soon. It was either the terrarium or a 10G aquarium, which has a smaller footprint.

Where do you all get your nightcrawlers and earthworms? Do you gut load them? If so with what? How many and how often do you feed them to your salamanders? All of the crickets that are fed to any of my animals are well gut loaded with a homemade gutload. Is this still something you would not suggest? I have them readily available to me, because I also breed chameleons, while earth worms are not something I feed to chameleons. Should the insects be dusted with calcium or multivitamins? If so, how often?

I have not had any trouble keeping the temps down. I keep my Condo at 70 degrees during the day, and drop it to 65 degrees at night. The LED lights that I am using transfer almost no heat to the terrarium.

The water dish that is in there right now is plenty large enough for him to completely submerge his entire body in it. I am sure that he will need something bigger as he grows, but this should work for at least a number of months.

I apologize for all of the questions, but I want to do the best I can for this little guy, and I truly appreciate all of the help!

I get my earthworms/nightcrawlers from around my house, which has no pesticides, fertilizers etc. so it is safe.
No I don't gut load them, and I don't think it is necessary.
Some people feed every other day or so, but not very much or vice versa. I feed my amphibians only once a week or longer, but I feed them quite a bit. I don't really have a routine, I just feed them when I feel I should.
Feeding crickets on occasion is probably fine, just don't put too many in at a time. But they shouldn't probably shouldn't be the salamander staple diet. Earthworms/nightcrawlers would be better, and would probably be more readily accepted.
I don't think crickets would need to be dusted if they are already gutloaded. Worms don't need either, unless you wanted to dust them with carotene to give the salamander more color. -Seth

I'm too much of a newbie to be any help to you, I just wanted to say welcome and give you and your roommate my appreciation for saving the little guy.

I would just like to point out that they didn't exactly save them. They could have just helped them across the road and let them be free. If I "saved" all the newts and salamanders I found on the road I would probably have close to a hundred.

On the other hand, this species is caught from the wild and sold into captivity a lot, and we really don't want to encourage the people who do that commercially, so collecting one like this yourself is much better.

sde said:

I would just like to point out that they didn't exactly save them. They could have just helped them across the road and let them be free. If I "saved" all the newts and salamanders I found on the road I would probably have close to a hundred.

On the other hand, this species is caught from the wild and sold into captivity a lot, and we really don't want to encourage the people who do that commercially, so collecting one like this yourself is much better.

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To be honest, if I had seen him in a pet store I would not have even been tempted to purchase him. I have no knowledge of salamanders, and the little I have learned so far has mostly been from this site. I do not make a habit of collecting wild animals from any species, but my roommate brought him into my home and so I will care for him to the best of my ability.

If I had, as you put it, "saved" every salamander I found in the road, I would still have just this one. I live in the Denver area and have not seen a wild salamander in more than 20 years. They are a rarity in my neck of the woods.

By the way, he was actually found crossing the road on a work site. Just helping him across the street, would probably not have saved his life. There is a good chance that a tractor or truck wheel would have found him anyway.

On another note, I went ahead and put more soil in his tank tonight. He now has about 5" to work with. I am going to try and get some night crawlers for him tomorrow. Are the ones you get at bait shops ok to use?

Lpsouth1978 said:

Are the ones you get at bait shops ok to use?

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The worms I use are worms from the fishing section in walmart, that are used for bait. I would think they're okay but I wouldn't use them if they're like glowing fluorescent green.

Lpsouth1978 said:

To be honest, if I had seen him in a pet store I would not have even been tempted to purchase him. I have no knowledge of salamanders, and the little I have learned so far has mostly been from this site. I do not make a habit of collecting wild animals from any species, but my roommate brought him into my home and so I will care for him to the best of my ability.

If I had, as you put it, "saved" every salamander I found in the road, I would still have just this one. I live in the Denver area and have not seen a wild salamander in more than 20 years. They are a rarity in my neck of the woods.

By the way, he was actually found crossing the road on a work site. Just helping him across the street, would probably not have saved his life. There is a good chance that a tractor or truck wheel would have found him anyway.

On another note, I went ahead and put more soil in his tank tonight. He now has about 5" to work with. I am going to try and get some night crawlers for him tomorrow. Are the ones you get at bait shops ok to use?

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I understand, and I wasn't trying to put you down or anything I was just trying to encourage people not to take things from the wild just because they feel they are saving them, but in this case you probably were actually saving him, he probably wouldn't have been alive much longer if you hadn't taken him.

That should be enough soil. How is he eating?

sde said:

I understand, and I wasn't trying to put you down or anything I was just trying to encourage people not to take things from the wild just because they feel they are saving them, but in this case you probably were actually saving him, he probably wouldn't have been alive much longer if you hadn't taken him.

That should be enough soil. How is he eating?

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Perhaps the biggest problem with forums is how easy it is to misread other members feelings in posts. I did not take anything personally and am thankful for all of the input.

He is doing very well so far. He rarely burrows into the soil, he just hides behind the log (right up against it). I am planning on getting him another, better, hide this weekend. As far as eating, he has eaten his fill of crickets twice since I got him. My roommate found him an earthworm (VERY small) yesterday, but he showed NO interest in it. I am going to get him some larger ones from the fishing bait place this weekend and see how he does with those.

Lpsouth1978 said:

Perhaps the biggest problem with forums is how easy it is to misread other members feelings in posts. I did not take anything personally and am thankful for all of the input.

He is doing very well so far. He rarely burrows into the soil, he just hides behind the log (right up against it). I am planning on getting him another, better, hide this weekend. As far as eating, he has eaten his fill of crickets twice since I got him. My roommate found him an earthworm (VERY small) yesterday, but he showed NO interest in it. I am going to get him some larger ones from the fishing bait place this weekend and see how he does with those.

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I would agree. It is very easy to mistake the tone the person is trying to use, since you aren't actually heating them.

Good to hear he has been eating good. The earthworm you offered might have just been to small, hard to say. Let us know how he likes the larger ones. :happy: -Seth

I went and got some red worms from Walmart earlier this week and he almost immediately attacked it. The worm was actually too long for him so I had to cut it in half while he was eating it. He has eaten 3 worms this week (well actually half of 3 worms). He is quite active and LOVES soaking in his little pond. It seems that he has adjusted very well to his new home.

One quick question... How quick do these guys grow? Right now he is about 4.5" nose to tip of tail.

Good to hear!

So it has been about 8 months since I last posted on here. This little guy was doing great, eating like a champ and then one day he decided it was time to hibernate. That was in November. It is now almost July and he is still hibernating. We dug him out yesterday just to be sure he is still ok and coaxed him out of his burrow. He seems to be no worse for the ware. He is nice and plump, drank a little bit, swam in his little pond, and then sometime last night he buried himself again and has not reappeared yet.

How long do these guys usually hibernate. It has now been almost 8 months, which seems like a very long time to me. I there anything I can do to help end his hibernation? Lots of misting? More heat? This is my first salamander ever and so far all he has done is sleep. At this point he has been a VERY boring pet.

He's so very cute and small! I love it.

I can't help you sadly with coaxing him out of hibernation, as my tiger has not hibernated at all yet (and I'm sad about that actually, the longest he's slept is a week and a half), but he should definitely be sleeping less by now.

They like coming out during the rain so I would suggest spraying (but not too much).

Can you post some more recent pictures of your set up? That may be helpful.

As long as he's plump I wouldn't worry too much, but I hope he starts being more entertaining for you soon lol.

Also, I find it very weird that someone would say earthworms and night crawlers are harder to digest than crickets... what the?!

Anyway, good luck to you!


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