Poison Dart Frog Viv/Terr Size HELP PLEASE

zoezakella · May 5, 2011

Hi all,

Well I am very excited as I have just purchased 3 Dendrobates azureus from Billy James so now need a viv for them

Now I dont want to be upgrading my viv constantly like I have done with my tanks for my axies so can you lovely people please tell me what is the ideal size exo terra viv or any viv for my 3 dart frogs please! I want them to have as much room as possible to live happy lives but also want to be able to see them so guessing too big they might get lost lol!

Anyway any help on this would be much appreciated as frogs are a new thing to me and I want to get this right! Have done loads of research and am looking forward to planting up my first viv

Zoe

Molch · May 5, 2011

well, no dart expert here, but aren't they territorial, at least some of the species? That's one thing to consider. Also, while they should have plenty of room, you'd also not want it too big so that you can maintain a good density of fruit flies or pinheads in there. I understand those darts eat constant large amounts of food.

And btw, photos, photos!!

zoezakella · May 5, 2011

Molch said:
well, no dart expert here, but aren't they territorial, at least some of the species? That's one thing to consider. Also, while they should have plenty of room, you'd also not want it too big so that you can maintain a good density of fruit flies or pinheads in there. I understand those darts eat constant large amounts of food.

And btw, photos, photos!!

Yes they are and I'm not either lol

Am setting one up as large as possible but again from what I have read they all say varying sizes so was really wondering what other people use for their darts.

Oh dont you worry when I get them you will get loads at the moment they are still with Billy with SOLD on them just need to set their viv up first :frog:

Thanks Molch

zoezakella · May 5, 2011

Was thinking about one of the 45cm x 45cm x 60cm but is that too big or too small do they prefer width to height to keep their territories seperate?

porkchop48 · May 5, 2011

Try for atleast a 29 gal tank for them to give them enough room. If you end up with all males or 2 males and one female you will be fine.

More than one female will fight.

Darts dont really need a constant large amount of food. My adults are fed every other day and froglets are fed 1-2 times a day. Stick with a diet of mainly fruit flies, a diet of nothing but crickets is not good for them.

If you have any questions...ask away I am happy to help.

zoezakella · May 5, 2011

porkchop48 said:
Try for atleast a 29 gal tank for them to give them enough room. If you end up with all males or 2 males and one female you will be fine.

More than one female will fight.

Darts dont really need a constant large amount of food. My adults are fed every other day and froglets are fed 1-2 times a day. Stick with a diet of mainly fruit flies, a diet of nothing but crickets is not good for them.

If you have any questions...ask away I am happy to help.

NO problem at all thanks!! Have been told they prefer width so will aim for that!

These guys/girls are 5 months old so when can they be sexed??

Fruit flies is what I am going for so appreciate that!

Many thanks for your time and help and you may regret your last sentence lol :happy:!

porkchop48 · May 5, 2011

The will use every inch of ground space you can give them. But also if you set the tank up properly ( with drift wood, large leafed plants etc) they will climb on everything.

Usually you can get a good idea on sex about 8-10 months. Sometimes younger but the older they get the better chance at accuracy

Make sure to culture you own fruit flies, it saves so much money as oppsed to buying them ready made all the time. And try a couple culture before you actually get the frogs just to make sure you can do it.

I have seen some people that just can not figure out the fruit fly thing

morg · May 5, 2011

read here for some basic info
Keeping Dartfrogs - a knol by AJ Cann

also check out this forum
Dendroworld • Index page

good luck with them

zoezakella · May 5, 2011

morg said:
read here for some basic info
Keeping Dartfrogs - a knol by AJ Cann

also check out this forum
Dendroworld • Index page

good luck with them

Cheers Morg,

Not seen those 2 yet (partly as I have been packing up axie eggs most nights this week and then working) have found loads on them so far though very exciting!

Thanks for your help!

Molch · May 5, 2011

porkchop48 said:
I have seen some people that just can not figure out the fruit fly thing

really? I have fruit fly cultures that basically take care of themselves. I completely forget about them except once every 3 weeks or so when I set up new cultures, which takes about 10 minutes.

benw · May 5, 2011

The leucs will be fine in a 60 x 45 x45, and they will use the space as already said!!

my advice would be to go for proper dart tank, many people, myself included, have used exo terra tanks, but the fruit flies will escape big time unless you are prepared to modify the tank somewhat, such as perspex on the top and mesh in the front aeration grill under the doors.

Use decent lighting too, with a reasonable amount of uv in it, best go for 10-12% as a good proportion will be defected by the mesh top and more if you go for the perspex option for the fruit flies.

Again pm me if you need any advice, also there are some good dart books out there too

Ben

porkchop48 · May 5, 2011

Molch said:
really? I have fruit fly cultures that basically take care of themselves. I completely forget about them except once every 3 weeks or so when I set up new cultures, which takes about 10 minutes.

Yes Really.

It may be humidity, temps or a number of other things. I make about 15 a week and do not have problems but again have had numerous people who just can't get it right.

UV light is not essential for frogs. I have noticed the bulbs tend to be a bit more expensive but offer no benefit for the frog.

benw · May 5, 2011

Whilst UV may not be essential to many species of frogs, they do have access to it in the wild, therefore its prudent i feel to use it, and the plants get a definate boost.

As the frogs arent exactly cheap and we want to look after them in the best way, is it not better to spend a little extra to give them the best envoironment we can??

Fruit cultures are so easy its unbelievable, and do last for ages, i used plastic pint glasses and my own recipe, get hundreds of flies per pot, but i also sieve leaves in the woods and get micro foods that way too, springtails etc.

porkchop48 · May 5, 2011

benw said:
Whilst UV may not be essential to many species of frogs, they do have access to it in the wild, therefore its prudent i feel to use it, and the plants get a definate boost.

As the frogs arent exactly cheap and we want to look after them in the best way, is it not better to spend a little extra to give them the best envoironment we can??

Fruit cultures are so easy its unbelievable, and do last for ages, i used plastic pint glasses and my own recipe, get hundreds of flies per pot, but i also sieve leaves in the woods and get micro foods that way too, springtails etc.

I am just passing along my experince of keeping and raising dart frogs for the last 5-6 years. Also with the types of top needed for the proper dart frog enclosure UV does not go through it.

I actually have a couple rows in my racks set up with UV bulbs that I got in a trade. There is absolutely no difference in the plant growth with the ones with or without UV.

And again I understand fruit flies are simple. I do not have a problem with them. Each house is different, different temps, humidity, etc. Some people just do not have good luck with them. There is a few people that I see monthly when I vend shows that buy fruit flys because they can not keep their own cultures thriving. I myself would want to make sure I can keep them thriving and alive for a few weeks before I got my frogs.

Buying fruit flies from a local pet store can get expensive if they even have them.

I am again just offering my opinion on what I have learned from raising them.

benw · May 6, 2011

Dont get me wrong, im not knocking your experience, im just saying tat the mesh used on, certainly, european types, that the mesh stops approx 50% of the uv, used by me with a uvb meter i borrowed, hence my suggestion of using 12% tube.

If you are happy with results without uv, then thats great, as long as the frogs and yourself are happy, thats great, that one of the may quirks of herp keeping!!!

Ben

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