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Metamorphosed Axolotl at pet store

Jaws

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to answer some of your questions im not sure if it is induced or not but the man i was talking about it with said they shoould live for 10 or more years, provided with the proper care.

im not sure how to post photos on this site but if someone could tell me i will happily put a photo i have of one of their golden morphs.

also the store was not in northern sydney but in glen waverly, victoria
 
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danchristopher

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definite is a strong word based on one pretty dark photo! It clearly isn't a regular axolotl (look at the eyes) and it sure doesn't look like any other morphed one I have seen in pictures. It has land areas - surely as a morpalotl it would stay on them rather than submerged in the same way a standard terrestrial salamander would?

Just because something isn't legal it doesn't mean you will never see it for sale in a shop.

Also why would a pet shop go to the trouble of deliberately morphing an axolotl (a difficult, uncertain and life-shortening process)? Something that can only ever make it a less attractive pet (in terms of health and lifespan)?

Sorry to drag this OT, I don't want to get into an argument about this, I just don't think it looks like an axolotl in any way.

...I'm not the best photographer but I don't think the photo is dark at all? O_O lol.
I don't believe the pet store morphed it on their own. In fact, I'd say for sure they didn't. They didn't have any other axolotls there for one, they also didn't seem very knowledgable about it. It is also a rather generic pet store chain in a shopping centre - I highly doubt they'd be out back performing experiments on axolotls. The fact they were calling it a "Mexicana Salamander" makes me think that whoever sold it to them has created this name for the lotls they're morphing and selling to unsuspecting pet stores who never bother to properly research anything, heh.

Australia also has extremely strict quarantine laws. Like, we're pretty hardcore about them as well. It would be very very risky for anyone to try and bring a live animal into this country without proper permits - not to mention the fines a pet store would receive for selling such an animal.

Jaws: to post a photo hit "Post Reply" and then below the post box and all the emoticons and Submit Reply and Preview Post buttons there is another box saying "Additional Options" under this there is an option to "attach files", hit "manage attachments" and you can upload image files there.
 

Jaws

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couldnt get my photo of the salamanders so had to get one off their website this is the same salamander i saw though.
 

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Schambers87

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With all this talk of concen I wAnt to know..
Can this be reported to your local authority. If it was happening where I live I would be reporting it before doing anything else! Our pet shops need licences to operate and these come with rules. Something like that I would assume Is a form of abuse/neglect whether they did it or not. If not the authorities would hopefully find those who are acting illegally and deal with it.
Particularly as you mention the restrictions your country have with regards to axolotl/salamanders.

Not having a moan but it's a point I just wanted to say :happy:
 

nina89

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I was just about to tell you all what I've just seen on aussiepythons.com then I noticed this post!
If you just search in the forum search engine "axolotl" Its amazing how many are for sale out there in the past 6 months or so.
:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
and the prices, how can they think to sell them for that much considering the poor axies health. As if they dont know the effects on the axolotl all you have to do is google axolotl morphing and almost all results mention its not healthy for the axie.:mad:
Its the same as amazingamazon.com.au they have had morphed axies for the past year or so. there is no chance they have had the same one advertised for so long they must be breeding and producing them themselves.

The issue with reporting I think might be the scary thought to all us axie fans here in aus that only have the one type of salamander,is that it may become banned. For the sake of the axie it is definitely worth reporting but at the same time its a risk.
 

LeFarge

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I stand corrected. I genuinely didn't think people would be that stupid/cruel.
 

Jennewt

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I don't understand why this should be "reported". I doubt there is any law against treating them with hormones to cause them to morph. It's been going on in Australia for a long time, and as long as people buy them it will continue. It's debatable whether or not it's cruel - some people would say yes, some would say no.

Every time the topic comes up (morphed axolotls being commercially produced in Australia) I always ask the same question. Can someone show me an example of a commercially-morphed axolotl that has lived more than one year in captivity? I do know of a spontaneous morph that lived 10+ years in the US, but I have not heard any reports of long-lived commercially-morphed axolotls. I tend to believe that this probably does reduce their lifespan, but the data are anecdotal.

In reply to the original query, see:
Caudata Culture Articles - Tiger Salamander 101
Caudata Culture Species Entry - Tiger salamander
 

Schambers87

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I admit I don't know a lot but any animal lover would see this as unnecessary suffering that can easily be avoided. In the uk that kind of treatment comes under Animal Welfare Act 2006. That's why If I thought it was happening near me and perhaps shouldn't be, I would at least look into it further...
 

RobynSYR

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Hi folks. I am a complete amphib neophyte. I find this story fascinating though.

Would someone fill me in on the basic details going on here?

How do you "induce" this animal to morph?

How does that affect the life span? From what to what?

Thanks : )
 

yellowpebble

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Its definitely an axolotl morph because it looks like one and no pet store would sell anything other than an axolotl in Australia. Its strictly against the law and no pet store would risk selling an ilegal import so publicly. Sure it happens but thats on a black market, there is no way they would make it into pet stores without them being shut down and the owners serving jail time withing the fisrt week of it being publicly available. No business owner would be that silly. There are very well revised species lists they can and can not sell.

It would be interesting to find out where they were coming from. See how they are produced and supplied. For pure interest i would confront the pet store manager. Say - hello, what type of salamander is that. When they say "Mexicana Salamander", say sorry thats species doesn't exist! And tell them that all salamanders except axolotl are illegal in Australia. Tell they you will report them for selling them... unless of course it is an axolotl morph. If they say finally it is an axolotl or are still unsure, ask them for the supplier, and say you are reporting them unless they can prove its an axolotl or you can contact the supplier to make sure. They should give you the supplier.

I know that sounds horrible... but i would do it. Would be interesting to know who is morphing them, how and why.


And Mexicanum salamander? Sounds like they are covering up the fact they are morphed axies, or they dont really know that much about what they are selling and in that case they shouldn't be selling them at all.
 
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FX1C

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I've recently seen a "salamander" for sale in a pet shop in sydney - the 15yr old sales assistant had no clue for further info! It looks like a morphed axie

e3u2ema9.jpg
 

jeneral

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I know little about Aussie law, but why are salamanders illegal in the first place? To prevent removing them from their natural habitats?

In order to preserve a lot of our own unique wildlife, there are very strict quarantine laws trying to prevent non native species taking over the natural habitats of natives and killing them off. One example that I can think of off the top of my head is with our River Murray, somehow carp got introduced (perhaps they are easier to catch?) and they have practically taken the thing over, making it difficult for the native Murray Cod to thrive. We now have rules that if fishing in the Murray and you catch a carp, you are not allowed to throw it back (regardless of its size), and if you catch a Murray Cod you need to throw it back (I have a feeling you need a permit if you are going to keep it). The once beautiful river is now a murky mess partially because of the carp. Our quarantine laws are trying to stop this from happening to other species. If salamanders were introduced and released into the wild, they would compete for food etc. with the natives and if they are successful may endanger species that are found no where else in the world.

Just because something isn't legal it doesn't mean you will never see it for sale in a shop.

Ignoring the possibility of smuggling them into the country, salamanders are not only illegal, they are simply not here. It is not as easy as buying them in a state where they are legal and bringing them across the border.
 

FX1C

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I live in Sydney & many years ago (probably 20!) I was given a pair or newts (no idea what species - but they were 100% newt) a few months later I wanted to increase the population & went to the markets where a guy was selling them previously - only to be told that he had been "caught" by an authority & that his stocks were confiscated & destroyed :(
So sadly my 2 were the only ones I ever got to experience & they were awesomely cute :)
 

curtpw

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I wouldn't support this by buying them. It shortens the axolotl's life span, and as I have heard, many morphers don't make it. Choosing to support this forced morphing is supporting a form of animal abuse - just saying.


This is factually incorrect.
1) Metamorphosis shortens the lifespan of an Axolotl only if the metamorphosis is chemically induced (usually with a Thyroxine injection) after sexual maturity. If metamorphosis takes place before sexual maturity lifespan is likely comparable to a Tiger Salamander (since this is 10+ years it can be a little difficult to verify).
2) Metamorphosis of Axolotls is rare but completely natural. 10% of the scientific stock Axolotl population spontaneously morphed after a three-hour truck ride: https://www.quantamagazine.org/axolotl-genome-slowly-yields-secrets-of-limb-regrowth-20180702/
 

tundrabadger

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Did you dig this up 6 years later entirely so you could disagree with it? Brother, you're not going to find a whole lot of people here who are going to agree with your idea.
 
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