Wesley not feeling too well, please help!

Hi guys,

Prepare for some tedious background information:

Formerly only had one axolotl, Kasper, in a tank of a size that was sufficient for her but not for another. So I got a bigger tank and a new axie friend called Wesley. They are about the same size though I have now had Kasper for about 8 months and Wesley for about four weeks. When I set up the new tank, I felt that I needed an additional 'hidey space' and so I bought two timber hollow logs.

(The clever people at the aquarium store neglected to tell me that the logs are treated with bleach which, if the logs aren't soaked for SIX TO TWELVE MONTHS, can leach out into the water). Which is exactly what happened.

After a couple of days with the logs in the tank, Wesley began gulping air to float. Kasper has never done this so I freaked out and it's actually what prompted me to become a member here, I was reading about possible causes, and figured it could be the water. I did the normal water tests, and while I can't remember the exact measurement, the water was very acidic. I freaked out and cleaned the entire tank out, and had a sneaking suspicion that the logs may have been the culprit, but left them in to see. The next morning the water was becoming acidic again so I pulled the logs out, fixed the water, and all was going well - this was about a week ago.

However, two days ago Wesley began floating again, constantly. He was very listless and I noticed that he has lost weight. Kasper is totally fine, plump and active, so I figure that Wesley may be more sensitive. He is melanoid and he kinda had white stuff on him, I touched a part of him very lightly and the white came away - his skin is peeling. I immediately put him in the fridge, have been doing all the right things etc, he's been in there for about 24 hours.

I just snuck a peek at him and noticed that he appears to have done a poo... a really big one! However (sorry, I need to be graphic here) it isn't like his normal, erm, movements, it actually looked like a chunk of beef heart which is the last thing I fed him. And in the container, it was kinda hanging off his face, so I don't know if it's a poo or if he threw up!

So, has Wesley been constipated, explaining his sickness? And his skin was also affected by the water? Should I leave him in the fridge for a while longer or can he come home now that the water is okay, his skin is back to normal and he appears to have 'passed' the problem.

I feel them both blood worms, pellets when they will take them, and occasionally beef heart. The water is around 17 degrees pretty consistently. There is no way that he has swallowed anything - I have rocks in the tank, but they are proper rocks, not pebbles, about eight times the size of a wide open axie mouth. The ph, ammonia, chlorine etc in the water is fine. I have never had a problem with Kasper at all.

Any advice would be very much appreciated. I am sorry that my tale is so long - I thought it would be best to enable you to fully understand the situation. I love my little pals and will do anything to save Wes! <3

So did you take out the 2 timber hollow logs thats causing the problems ?

Haha yes. They have been gone for about a week. The water is now totally fine, Kasper is in there and she's A-OK.

Hi Axiewhisperer,

I think your salvage plan is good. You are doing everything in a logical and sensible sequence. Since the logs are suspicious, i would completely do away with them (preferably) or at least soak them for several days and rinse them thoroughly.

i would say the logs sound more suspicious as chemicals could cause a chemical insult that can cause skin shedding/peeling. The poo could be coincidental. The nice calm and cool environment of the fridge can have that effect.

Thank you - you have reassured me!

I have banished the offending logs to a cupboard in the laundry. I would not feel comfortable using them again in water even if I soaked them, however may hold onto them for my friend who keeps hermit crabs - they can be a nice DRY home for the crabs!

Wesley is looking much better, I won't feel comfortable until he gains back some weight but fingers crossed he will be able to overcome this.

UPDATE: Please help!

Since Wesley seemed to be back to normal, I put him back in his home where he promptly started to float again, then he would swim crazily with his body almost vertical under the water and his head poking out.

He is back in the fridge now and I just don't get it. He is very limp and I don't know if he's gonna make it. I think he was only okay because he was in the fridge.

The logs are gone. The water chemistry is normal. The other axolotl is fine and has been watching Wesley with a kinda bemused 'you're weird' look. Not only that but the other axie still has a voracious appetite. Wesley's skin thing isn't evident anymore.

Have you got ANY ideas? I am at a loss and, assuming the poor guy makes it, plan to leave him in the fridge for a few weeks. Is he just plain sick still and needs a long rest in the fridge?

I think keeping Wesley in the fridge for a long vacation would be a good move. In conjunction with fridging an axolotl can go without food for about three months, as the fridge slows the axolotls metabolism to the point where the axolotl does not need to eat. Advantageously, the weight loss will also be slowed right down.

This fridging guide will be of assistance: http://www.caudata.org/axolotl-sanctuary/Fridging.shtml

While stressed out of his mind the axolotl will not eat. Fridging will help relax and destress Wesley, which will help him heal. If Wesley is still floating while in the fridge, bring the water level down so his back is covered and he is able to touch the ground.

If you could also take some photos of Wesley, that would be of help.

Please keep us posted, and good luck!

Thank you! I read the guide and seem to have done everything right. The axolotl in the photo actually looks exactly the same as poor ol' Wes, the container is even almost identical.

He is not floating in the fridge. I will leave him in there for a few weeks to heal.

Much appreciate the assistance.

I will keep you posted! I will also take some photos when I can, though there isn't much happening except he is very skinny, his gills are very short (they have been since we got him, all this stress has prevented them from growing back I suppose).

In the meantime, it is some consolation that his former tankmate Kasper is currently perched in a tree, balancing on one leg, with a big cheesy grin on his face and some bloodworms in his belly.

axiewhisperer said:

In the meantime, it is some consolation that his former tankmate Kasper is currently perched in a tree, balancing on one leg, with a big cheesy grin on his face and some bloodworms in his belly.

Click to expand...

Yes, an axolotls social graces amount to zilch - it adds to their charm .

While Wesley is enjoying his vacation in the fridge, try leaving him some small earthworms or blackworm (these survive for days in fridged water) in the tub with him overnight, and he may partake in privacy. Don't be alarmed if he doesn't eat while in the fridge though, this is normal.

You can also try bloodworm, but these should be removed if not eaten after a couple of hours at most - don't leave them in with him overnight, as they will foul the water.

You can also try to tempt him with finely cut beef strips, beef heart or chicken liver - but please feed these as a treat - not as staple.

Hi axiewhisperer,

Whilst your axie is recuperating in the fridge, its also best time to work out if there is anything wrong with the water in the main tank.

What is the water temperature? What are the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels? Does the water take on a particular colour/turbidity? Are there are any smells?

I don't know what chemicals are used to treat logs but i suppose some chemicals (not detected by usual water parameter test kit) can still be present in the water if leached out. They can be invisible/odourless and toxic enough to cause illness even in trace minute quantities.

Have you performed water changes?

Cheers

Hello,

I have cleaned the tank out. I should have been more specific above but every last drop of water is gone! Now working on getting the tank cycled again (gggrrr) but the levels are all fine. 20% water changes daily since I emptied the tank. Water around 17 degrees celcius fairly constantly. There is literally nothing wrong with the water according to the usual tests, and I have been testing ammonia etc twice a day. My other axie is perfectly fine and happy, eating like a pig etc. The logs are in a different room even.

The water is clear, smells totally normal.

Any other ideas?

Maybe poor Wes just needs some time in hospital to recuperate from the shock to his system?

It's so strange, last night I put him back in the tank as mentioned above, and I did that because he looked so totally fine. As soon as he was back in the tank, floating again, then he went all limp and I thought he was going to die so, back to the fridge.

Also, I assumed that the acidity in the water caused the problem. But I read last night that axies are very tolerant to ph and can handle from between 5 and 8 ph. The water was only in the low sixes.

I have an assignment to finish tonight but tomorrow night I will take a pic or two of Wes.

Thanks for the suggestions! Feel free to offer more!!

Update:

Wesley still in fridge, not eating still, no improvement, gets quite distressed and kinda wriggles around when I move his container for water changes. I took some pictures while changing water before.

Wesley is in the first two pictures in his little contained. Poor little man.

And on a brighter note, meet my little Kasper in the second two pictures. <3 Isn't she a heartbreaker.

Oh and edit re. my tank. The little 'pot plant' in the front there is the only real one. The tank doesn't get much sun where it is so if that plant makes it I am going to get some lovely lush ones. And don't freak out when you see the log to the right of the shot.. IT IS NEW AND MADE OF CERAMIC!!! Haha. Note my very charming frozen Coke bottle floating in there also and my combie which Kasper loves to hide behind.

Hi Elle,

What is your water pH?

Your axie looks fairly well based on the photos. I suggest keeping him fridged for at least another 2 weeks. Don't worry about the axie not eating while in the fridge. Due to the cold, there is reduced demand for food, although you should still continue to offer small portions of food regularly. Have you tried live worms (blackworms, chopped earthworms)? They can help stimulate feeding due to their enticing wriggliness.

I think although its a bother cycling the tank all over again, it might be worthwhile in the long run.

Cheers

Thanks Darkmaverick.

Don't know if you've seen on the news, but I live on the Gold Coast and we are having some absolutely insane weather here so I was worried all day about the power going out including the fridge haha.

I've just now checked the water.

Ph is perfectly 7. Ammonia is 0. Nitrite is 0. Nitrate is between 0 and 5 (between colours on the card). Temp is also fine.

I wouldn't have expected the water to be okay so quickly, is it because Kasper is in the tank? It really hasn't been that long since I emptied the entire tank. I do have a little live plant in there, and I haven't been feeding Kasp as much.

I tell myself it's to be expected that he won't eat but he is soo skinny that I still hate it. I tried to get some 'live' food but I work 8:30am to 5:00pm - exact aquarium store hours! I have tried him with shaking some blood worm and also some beef heart near his nose, he walked away. Just not peckish I suppose.

Hi Elle,

Have you tried live food like an earthworm? sometimes this can stimulate the axolotl into abit of a hunting mode and sometimes not. Well worth a try.

Good luck with the mad weather, looks pretty grim on the news

Ianclick,

(Are you mean to call people by their username or the other name? Don't want to make a faux pas here!).

I wouldn't trust any earthworms I found here... chemical city! But I think I should definitely get some form of live food over the weekend for little Wes. Thanks for the suggestion.

The weather here has been insane. Today was fine but it is expected to get blown back up from the south tomorrow. There was deck furniture from the balconies of highrise buildings blown down onto the street! And a man we dealt with often through my work was sadly killed when an awning went through his office window. I never met him myself but everyone speaks very highly of him - very sad and makes you appreciate life all the more. And I am quite petite so walking against the wind has resulted in me nearly being picked up and carried away a few times!

Hi Elle,

Either is fine and better than some of the names I have been called.

Thats terrible news, I hope it passes quickly but out to sea and not in our direction. Best of Luck with the weather and wesley.

Hi all,

Thanks for your help with this but sadly little Wes died sometime last night. It had been a couple of weeks and he was doing fine so I put him back in the tank where he was okay at first, he even ate something (and promptly spat it back out again) but last night he started doing the strangest thing where his body was like vertical under the water and his head was sticking out of the water and he was kind of thrashing about. I was afraid to put him back in the fridge thinking another temperature change so soon might do more harm than good, but when I checked on him this morning he was on his side quite dead, the poor little guy.

Kasper is fine and I actually started to think there was something more wrong with Wes. His hands became kind of twisted and looked as though his fingers were broken, and his back even had a bend to it... my partner said it looked almost like when a human has scoliosis. Even though he wanted food (he nipped me in his haste to have some) he would just spit it out straight away.

If you have any ideas, I would love to hear them. I will definitely be getting Kaspy another friend and obviously want to prevent this from happening again. The water is normal, filter turned against wall and not particularly strong so no stress there, good diet (when he would eat), and huge rocks so definitely not impaction.

I do feel quite bad because I feel responsible but in a way I know I did so much to save him and I think he was suffering for quite a while so maybe best for poor Wes.

Thanks for any feedback.

RIP Wes... I will miss your little fat face and your cheeky grin and hope you're happier in axie heaven! :sad:

Edit: One last question, I intend (this weekend) to change the large rocks in my tank to sand (maybe will keep a couple in there for aesthetic reasons). I have read on the forum before where the best types of sand were mentioned, but I was happy with my rocks at the time and didn't pay much notice. Any advice as to the best sand to use (nothing too exxy, with me just a humble uni student/underpaid assistant valuer) and where I can buy it? I think it will make cleaning much easier, especially as I feed messy blood worms.

Sorry to hear about your loss. I think as your other axie is doing fine Wes may have just been a little bit more sensitive, but I am really worried about mine now as she is doing the exact thing that Wesley was doing, with the swimming frantically vertically with her head out the water. I hope she doesn't follow in his footsteps, but I really don't know what to do for her.

Well it's pretty obvious you tried as well as you could have, so like you said, least he will be happy in axie heaven now, sorry I don't have any more valuable feedback.. Good luck with your next axolotl

Hi Bex255,

Wesley did have a lot of problems before he started doing his strange darting thing, hopefully your axie will be okay. All I know about the darting thing is that it's a stress thing. I also agree that Wesley was a bit more sensitive, maybe coupled with a pre-existing health problem it all got too much for him?

Any idea what could be causing her stress, you've tested the water for everything? Sorry if you're rolling your eyes going 'duh'. I went through every possible scenario, all I can come up with now is that possibly there was a bit of rotting food trapped somewhere that upset Wesley, however you would think that would be reflected in the results of the countless tests I performed on the water!! I think I will definitely get the sand this weekend, and may even devise a technique where I take Kasper out of the main tank for his dinner when messy blood worms are on the menu, it's so hard to get them all and I don't want to risk it.

Why don't you put your axie in the fridge? It did give me time to figure it all out, however it may have been a bit too late for Wes. I found it calmed him down enormously though and only wish I had done it sooner.

Good luck! I will be thinking of her.