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Axolotl won't eat!

ljzweimiller

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Hello,

I am a first-time axolotl owner, and my axie has recently started refusing food. The temp is 19 C, and I have a homemade splash rod to decrease current from the filter. I'm not sure of the pH and ammonia levels, but I change about 30% of the water twice a week when I siphon out wastes from the bottom of the tank (I have very large rocks on the bottom, large enough not to be eaten). My axolotl is not an adult yet. He/she is only about 4-4.5 inches long. I think she may have some sort of bacterial or fungal infection as she has some grayish spots on her face (but they are not really anywhere else on her body). I have been doing salt baths for the past four days. She has only refused to eat anything for the past two days, before that it was just a lot less. I have read a little bit about refrigerating axolotls, but I don't know how long to do it or even if that would help. I feed it axolotl pellets, and it ate brine shrimp before that, but transitioned very well. He'she is not floating, and is still pretty active. I thought about buying some antibiotic/antifungal stuff from the pet store, but would like to know if there is anything else I can do before I spend more money. I have attached some pictures. My camera is not very good, but you can see a sort of grayish tinge on the face. At first I thought it was just more pigmentation as he/she aged as it hasn't changed, but now I'm starting to worry. Please help! Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I wish I knew the sex so I could stop saying he/she! I have named it Lucy for the time being in hopes it is a female.
 

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Mac Myers

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Hi!
I'm no pro... but the animal looks good to me. Too young to sex. We'll get into food items later.
You need to get a decent test kit and determine the water parameters. If not then find a pet store that can test your water and give you the results. We have to have the parameters and info below.
How large is the tank, what sort of filtration? Plants?
How long has the tank been set up? What sort of rocks or other "furnishings"? :confused:
DO NOT buy anything at the pet store. :uhoh: We need your water parameters first. :happy:
 

ljzweimiller

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It's a ten gallon tank about 10x20 inches. It has a tetra filter that came with the tank, and I have 3 live plants in there. The tank has been set up for about 3 months, but I recently added a PVC pipe "tunnel" for it to hide in. Seems to really like hanging out in there. There is also a large piece of faux drift wood (which you can see part of in the pics). There is a small (few inches long) bubble stone in the tank which I keep at a low setting. He/she really likes that, too. The whole bottom is covered in rocks which are much too large to ingest.

I am going to try and find some earthworms in my yard to feed my axolotl. I live in a somewhat rural area where I cannot find much live food for her unless I go to a fishing bait store, and I don't know if I should do that. Honestly, pellets are cheap and easy.

Will get a test kit ASAP and let you know the results!

Thank you for your interest and help!
 

ljzweimiller

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Ah. I think I have found the problem. pH is 8-8.5! Nitrate and Nitrite are both very low, but alkalinity was 300ppm (high). According to this test, the water hardness was 25 ppm which they consider low, so I don't know what is causing the high pH. The test strip I bought does not test for ammonia directly, it uses the alkalinity reading to tell you if the ammonia level is too high. Might buy some strips just for ammonia. Anyway, I need more H+ ions! Going to buy something to neutralize the pH.

I don't get it... the water is filtered, changed regularly, and I siphon out the wastes from the bottom. If my water is supposedly not hard, why is the pH so high?
 

ljzweimiller

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Tested water from faucet. Results were about the same. High pH, high alkalinity, but soft water. Does this mean I will have to treat my water with pH corrector constantly? In case anyone asks, I do use a treatment to remove chloride everytime I change or add any water.
 

Ken Worthington

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Hi,sorry to hear about your axolotl. If I could offer some advice as to the pH;

I would avoid using a chemical pH adjuster.
A sudden significant change in pH will do him more harm than good.
Bog-wood will lower the pH slightly (and look great).....the tannin it leeches will still be present after a long pre-soak but might help in this situation.
Maintaing water conditions gets easier with the bigger the tank you have.

This is just from my very limited experience, I'm sure you'll get the advice you need from the experts shortly ;)
 

ljzweimiller

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Awesome! Thanks! I would prefer a more natural solution, so I am thankful you have told me about bog-wood. I will definitely look into it!
 

ljzweimiller

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I have read that driftwood also releases acidic tannins, and is much easier (and cheaper) to obtain. Apparently, messing with the pH of your tank is somewhat tricky. BUT, according to these tests, my water is soft, which means there are not as many buffering compounds to keep the pH high. I also have a filter on one of my faucets to remove some of the buffering compounds (or so I have read), so that the pH is more stable, and will not shoot back up.

I think I will get some driftwood, and see if that helps. I don't want to use chemicals, unless the driftwood does not lower the pH enough. If need be, I can mix distilled water into my filtered tap water, but would rather not spend more money than need be.

Do you guys think that lowering the pH will actually lower the ammonia levels? If not, what do I do then?
 

Jacquie

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The only thing I would recommend you buy is an ammonia test kit. Please DO NOT buy the test-strips, these are notorious for giving woefully innaccurate readings. When it comes to Ammonia, you really do need accuracy in your water chemistry readings. I recommend the test tube kits - these are the best and are highly accurate.

While the tank is still in the process of cycling (I'm making this assumption based on your test result for Nitrite: "Nitrate and Nitrite are both very low"), I would be doing daily partial water changes. Toxins will build very quickly in a smallish tank, and this can make the axolotl quite sick.

When you buy the ammonia test kit (hopefully, the test tube type), could you post your results?

The best way to neutralize ammonia is to cycle the tank. Cycling can take one to three months to complete. But as you already have a reading for Nitrite and Nitrate, the cycle is well on its way. When the Ammonia and Nitrite read at a consistant '0', and you have a reading for Nitrate, the tank will be considered cycled.

Axolotls accept the wide range of pH 6.5 - 8.0, so if your pH is higher than 8, then yes, it's a little high. I think Ken's suggestion of bogwood is the best solution.

I thought about buying some antibiotic/antifungal stuff from the pet store

Most fish remedies are highly toxic to axolotls and should be avoided, particularly if they contain any malachite green.
 
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Ken Worthington

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Hi, you can get some really nice pieces of bogwood and mopani root from pet shops.
These would be preferable to wood that you might find on your travels as they'll be 'uninhabited' by potential nasties. In either case you'd be wise to boil the wood for a while, then soak it in clean (treated) water before considering introducing it to the tank. I can warn you before-hand that the wood will discolour the water slightly :rolleyes: but this is only temporary and a pre-soak for a week or so is what I did.

Your pH is fine if it's 8, but 8.5 starts to affect the water chemistry. You say that your tap water is filtered before it comes out of the tap. What sort of filter is it? Reverse Osmosis filter?

You should only use distilled water for misting tanks (which is irrelevant in this case) as it is too 'pure' for anything else. What you might want to get is bottled spring water, which has trace elements and minerals dissolved in it.

The main thing is to get accurate readings for your water....I can recommend the API freshwater test-kit and as Jacquie says post the results

Hope this helps ;)
 

Ken Worthington

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Sorry, I just thought I'd add that tannin has fungicidal properties.

By the way, the signs of fungus you describe aren't just melanophores are they (spots on the face, typical in Leucistic types) ? In which case that is perfectly natural, healthy, and characteristic.......fingers crossed ;)

Here's a link about bottled water btw http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/Spring_water.shtml
 
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ljzweimiller

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OK. Will get an ammonia test kit today and post results. By the way, the readings for nitrate and nitrite were both zero on the test strip I used, so I'm not sure that the tank is anywhere close to cycled from what you have said. I recently removed a significant amount of water when I had to move the tank to a cooler area (no strong person to help me move it with all the water in it) so I think that may be the issue. She started eating less after the move, so I think this may be the cause. Will know more when I get an ammonia reading (from test-tube kit) I suppose.

I'm not familiar with what cycling is. Can someone please explain? Did I initiate the cycling by removing most of the water, and replacing with new? Is there anything I need to do other than frequent water changes?

I'm hoping the wood will be enough to lower the pH just using my tap water. If not I will mix in SPRING WATER, and hope that helps. I do not have an RO filter on my faucet, so I dont think it will do much in the way of removing buffering compounds. I think it's just activated charcoal. Since I have to soak the wood, it will be awhile before I can actually put it in the tank. What should I do now to get the pH down, or should I just wait? I'm assuming its not her main problem right now.

Ken- the spots are just on the face, and are probably melanophores, as you have described. I did not know that they were common in leucistic types. They developed over time, have not changed, and appear to be pigmentation, not raised on the skin. I just got worried when she stopped eating. Thank you for the information!

Thank you everyone for all your help! Hopefully, the tank just needs to finish cycling, and I will do a water change everyday until this happens. I think this may be the main cause of her not eating, because the two events seem to be correlated.
 

ljzweimiller

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OK. The ammonia level is about 2.0 ppm! Nitrate and nitrite are both zero still. I think the large water change screwed up all my bacteria. However, my plants and decorations should have retained some of the bacteria, so hopefully it won't take too long to cycle again. I am hoping my axie will be ok as long as I change some of the water everyday. Before today, it had been a few days since the last water change. She ate a little bit yesterday, too which is good.

Is there anything else I should do? I don't want to use chemicals to decrease the ammonia level, especially since it is food for the bacteria that I am trying to grow. Any suggestions?

I feel so bad for doing this to my axolotl :( I hope I can rectify the situation.
 

endempire

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I think you just need to follow the advice about cycling on the link posted by Ken Worthington. The article doesn't specify how much water you should be changing when doing Cycling with animals, but it seems to be the general consensus that 20-25% daily water changes are good (2.5 Gallons for your tank).

To combat the high Ammonia levels I think you can do some greater water changes to get it down - but get confirmation from someone more wiser as this could be wrong and detrimental to the cycling!

You can always fridge your axie. It'll get it out of the toxic water, it won,t need to eat much at all, and it's generally relaxing for the axie. Meanwhile you get the tank cycled (or at least reduce the levels of Ammonia).

And yeh grab a test kit - the one that tests Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, Ph and High Ph with the little test tubes. I got a API Freshwater Master Test kit - a bit pricey, but it'll last for ages, and you'll be certain what all the water parameters are.

Good luck mate
Max
 

Jacquie

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OK. The ammonia level is about 2.0 ppm! Nitrate and nitrite are both zero still. I think the large water change screwed up all my bacteria. However, my plants and decorations should have retained some of the bacteria, so hopefully it won't take too long to cycle again. I am hoping my axie will be ok as long as I change some of the water everyday. Before today, it had been a few days since the last water change. She ate a little bit yesterday, too which is good.

Is there anything else I should do? I don't want to use chemicals to decrease the ammonia level, especially since it is food for the bacteria that I am trying to grow. Any suggestions?

I feel so bad for doing this to my axolotl :( I hope I can rectify the situation.

It's great that Lucy is eating.

Please do not use any chemical fixes! Chemicals and axolotls do not mix. Axolotls breath in part through their skin and chemicals can harm their natural slime coat. Partial daily water changes are all you need to do to decrease the ammonia levels. Once the cycle is complete, you will only need to do partial water changes about once a week.

Cycling with a live animal is a balancing act. There needs to be some ammonia (a necessary evil) in the water order to feed the developing bacteria, but on the other hand you need to keep the levels dilluted to acceptable levels (the bare minimal!) for the sake of the axolotl living in this water.

Hang in there! ;)

As this is your first time cycling a tank, I would recommend buying test tube kits for Nitrite and Nitrate. These kits will tell you how the cycle is going.

Don't feel bad! You've done a hell of a lot of reading and research and you're doing what you can to fix the situation. Lucy is very lucky to have you.
 

endempire

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Also you might consider changing out the pebbles for either sand or no substrate. This is because the pebbles trap ridiculous amounts of waste which trashes the water quality. It is important to vacuum up all waste during the cycling process to ensure lower levels of Ammonia.

I originally had similar size pebbles which I would clean with a siphon and a turkey baster, but man you should have seen the waste that came out when I changed it over to sand! Crazy amounts.
 

ljzweimiller

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Thanks everyone! I will continue doing my best with the cycling. Have already purchased better test kits for this purpose, and for future use. Also, I still plan on putting a piece of wood in there to lower the pH (which a better test said was 8).

Lucy ate a little more today than she has been, and was very hyperactive afterwards (which is more normal behavior for her). I think these are good signs. If she begins to get too ill, I will refrigerate her, but I don't think that is necessary right now.

Thought about changing to sand, but don't like the idea of having to put more and more in after sucking it out with my siphon. I really don't mind moving the rocks around to get the waste out, and I think they may act as a nice surface for some beneficial bacteria to grow on.

Just two more questions. 1) Wouldn't removing her screw up the cycling? 2) If I were to refrigerate her, how long would I do that for, and how often would I need to change the water?

Again, thank you all so much. It is very kind of you to take interest in others' problems and advise them. I have gained so much knowledge through this.
 
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