Question: Absorption of glucose...please teach me

r24111

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Some of Wuper Looper/axolotl (We, Japanese, call Axolotl "Wuper Looper") sometimes become not to eat anything, and most of them is said to be because of stress...
And then, we try to impruve their environmental condition, most of all, without good couase.
One of the way is to use salt water.
It is because Wuper Looper can absorb salt and water transdermaly... I hear they can absorb even oxygen. And their skin has many microorgan, grands, Ion channel, and so on.
What about glucose???

I want to see if they can absorb glucose transdermaly or not to get another way.
For, if it may be possible, even when Wuper Looper eat nothing at all, containing glucose to the salt water, transdurmal glucose may help them to get energy enough to keep alive...

If someone know about their transdermal glucose absorption, please show me!!
 
Hello,

Salt baths are actually not good for the axolotl per se. A salt bath can be used as a treatment, for example of a fungus - the salt kills the fungus. Salt can harm the axolotl, though, and should therefore only be used where there is a specific need.

As to glucose absorbtion, I have read something interesting, which I will quote here:

The solution you are referring to is calcium gluconate. It passes straight through the amphibians skin and provides calcium and an essential sugar that can help a starving animal bounce back. I've only heard of it being used a few times myself but it sounds interesting. In the US you can buy it from farm supply stores (like Fleet Farm) as it is used for livestock. It needs to be refrigerated.

If you try calcium gluconate, I would be very interested to kow how it works.

-Eva
 
I have used powdered glucose to bolster the health of sick marine fish. One teaspoon a gallon in a one hour bath proves very effective, of course a big difference is that saltwater fishes drink but it may help you establish a safe dosing rate..
 
Thank you very much!
I know well the substance "calcium gluconate"!! It is often used for treatment of hypocalcemia.
But, I didn't know the structure of gluconate which is really closed to glucose...
It may be available easily.

If it can easily absorve from their skin easily, and easily changes to glucose, it may be used
to impruve their poor nutrition, just like intravenous drip we use to human.

BUT,
Now, My pretty Wupers are all healthy...:lol:
I will try next time one of them become not to eat and recovery is difficult.
 
Oh, I paid attension only to absorption from their skin. But, they must drink much water in the aquarium. Their skin must be an organ not only for absorption but for excresion.
So, It is not bad idea. They drink, even when they don't eat, maybe...
Simple addition of glucose may effective...
Of course, I AM NOT SURE. It's only hypothesis not based on evidence...
 
That is correct - axoltols breathe and excrete through their skin as well as in the more familar ways.

-Eva
 
Hi r24111,

I still remember the time i went to japan for a holiday and saw axolotls at the aquarium shop. I have seen the giant japanese salamander at the zoo as well!

You have raised an interesting question and frankly i have been researching fervently since then to see if i can find anything of use.

Blueberlin (eva) has given good advice as usual, especially regarding the use of salt baths. I agree with her that it should only be used to treat fungal infections and not unnecessarily.

The axolotl skin consists of two main layers. The epidermis with its outer horny layer or stratum corneum and the underlying dermis. The stratum corneum prevents dessication (especially when metamorphosized) and is periodically shed and renewed.

The epidermis possesses various mucous and granular glands which extends into the dermis. The mucous glands are distributed all over the body and produce a slimy secretion that keeps the skin moist and facilitates respiration.

The granular glands are located in particular parts of the body such as the parotid glands at the sides of the neck. They produce specialised secretions such as digestive enzymes and in some other species of salamanders, can even be toxic.

The dermis is well supplied by blood vessels which is also essential for respiration and also contains pigment cells which gives the axolotl its unique colouration.

You are also right that amphibian skin has ion channels. However the skin has selective permeability to electrolytes and micronutrients so you cannot guarantee the axie will absorb whatever you place it in, in the right amount you want. Transdermal route of fluid therapy is not unheard of but i would go with an intracoelomic or subcutaneous injection instead. These routes ensure that the fluids/electrolytes/glucose/vitamins administered is in the right volume and concentration, and delivered to the animal.

Vets often use a special amphibian ringer solution or saline solution composed of some electrolytes (and even vitamins/glucose) to hydrate dehydrated and emaciated amphibians. We can administer an isotonic solution (or hypertonic then isotonic) solution to the salamander. Calcium gluconate can be used in emergencies to correct hypoglycaemia and hypocalcaemia. That has definitely been performed in vet practice.

However, there is still a lot of space for further research to fully understand the unique physiology of amphibians and even to titrate the right dosage of treatments. The above methods are quite honestly emergency protocols to try salvage. They are not methods to replace proper nutrition in your axolotl.

For an inappetant/ poor body condition axolotl, you have correctly identified stress as one of the reasons. Always find the underlying cause and treat it first. Ensure good environmental conditions such as good water chemistry (0 ammonia, nitrite, <60 nitrate, pH neutral), ideal water temp of around 18 degree celsius, low water currents, dim lighting conditions, no other aggressive conspecifics or cross species tank companions, no gravel substrate and proper hiding places.

Next check that is is not suffering from a concurrent illness or disease. Monitor for signs of illness like lesions and gill pathology. Check if there is unusual behaviour such as writhing. Parasites (both ectoparasites and intestinal helminths) can cause inappetance or loss in body condition. A vet can obtain faecal samples for faecal float, microscopy, culture and staining.

Axolotls obtain most of their nutrition via the intestinal tract. Therefore, offering a large variety of nutritious food, including live earthworms, bloodworms etc. should be the first treatment. Live food can stimulate feeding. Also check that the water temperature is not too high (stress) or not to cold (low digestibility) which causes regurgitation.

Lastly, there is a difference in treatment of fully aquatic axolotls versus terrestrial axolotls. Their skin structure is slightly different, so is their physiology. For a fully aquatic species. i would be most hesitant to administer something directly into their water, be it glucose or salt. Unlike terrestrial axolotls, they cannot escape or move away from the water environment and are hence much more vulnerable to the effects. Even if you add something 'harmless' like glucose into the water, you are essentially changing the concentration gradient. The axolotl's skin and gills are sensitive to such changes and can be damaged as a result. It is much safer for a vet to give it the necessary nutrients and fluids via a subcutanous or intracoelomic injection.

Cheers.
 
Hi r24111,

I still remember the time i went to japan for a holiday and saw axolotls at the aquarium shop. I have seen the giant japanese salamander at the zoo as well!

You have raised an interesting question and frankly i have been researching fervently since then to see if i can find anything of use.

Blueberlin (eva) has given good advice as usual, especially regarding the use of salt baths. I agree with her that it should only be used to treat fungal infections and not unnecessarily.

The axolotl skin consists of two main layers. The epidermis with its outer horny layer or stratum corneum and the underlying dermis. The stratum corneum prevents dessication (especially when metamorphosized) and is periodically shed and renewed.

The epidermis possesses various mucous and granular glands which extends into the dermis. The mucous glands are distributed all over the body and produce a slimy secretion that keeps the skin moist and facilitates respiration.

The granular glands are located in particular parts of the body such as the parotid glands at the sides of the neck. They produce specialised secretions such as digestive enzymes and in some other species of salamanders, can even be toxic.

The dermis is well supplied by blood vessels which is also essential for respiration and also contains pigment cells which gives the axolotl its unique colouration.

You are also right that amphibian skin has ion channels. However the skin has selective permeability to electrolytes and micronutrients so you cannot guarantee the axie will absorb whatever you place it in, in the right amount you want. Transdermal route of fluid therapy is not unheard of but i would go with an intracoelomic or subcutaneous injection instead. These routes ensure that the fluids/electrolytes/glucose/vitamins administered is in the right volume and concentration, and delivered to the animal.

Vets often use a special amphibian ringer solution or saline solution composed of some electrolytes (and even vitamins/glucose) to hydrate dehydrated and emaciated amphibians. We can administer an isotonic solution (or hypertonic then isotonic) solution to the salamander. Calcium gluconate can be used in emergencies to correct hypoglycaemia and hypocalcaemia. That has definitely been performed in vet practice.

However, there is still a lot of space for further research to fully understand the unique physiology of amphibians and even to titrate the right dosage of treatments. The above methods are quite honestly emergency protocols to try salvage. They are not methods to replace proper nutrition in your axolotl.

For an inappetant/ poor body condition axolotl, you have correctly identified stress as one of the reasons. Always find the underlying cause and treat it first. Ensure good environmental conditions such as good water chemistry (0 ammonia, nitrite, <60 nitrate, pH neutral), ideal water temp of around 18 degree celsius, low water currents, dim lighting conditions, no other aggressive conspecifics or cross species tank companions, no gravel substrate and proper hiding places.

Next check that is is not suffering from a concurrent illness or disease. Monitor for signs of illness like lesions and gill pathology. Check if there is unusual behaviour such as writhing. Parasites (both ectoparasites and intestinal helminths) can cause inappetance or loss in body condition. A vet can obtain faecal samples for faecal float, microscopy, culture and staining.

Axolotls obtain most of their nutrition via the intestinal tract. Therefore, offering a large variety of nutritious food, including live earthworms, bloodworms etc. should be the first treatment. Live food can stimulate feeding. Also check that the water temperature is not too high (stress) or not to cold (low digestibility) which causes regurgitation.

Lastly, there is a difference in treatment of fully aquatic axolotls versus terrestrial axolotls. Their skin structure is slightly different, so is their physiology. For a fully aquatic species. i would be most hesitant to administer something directly into their water, be it glucose or salt. Unlike terrestrial axolotls, they cannot escape or move away from the water environment and are hence much more vulnerable to the effects. Even if you add something 'harmless' like glucose into the water, you are essentially changing the concentration gradient. The axolotl's skin and gills are sensitive to such changes and can be damaged as a result. It is much safer for a vet to give it the necessary nutrients and fluids via a subcutanous or intracoelomic injection.

Cheers.



Thank you for your excelent recture.
I used dictionary almost one hundred times to understand:eek:. I'm not good at English, so I needed many time to understand..., but it is really instructive for me.

By the way, I used the ward " salt bath" for " hypotonic or isotonic solt bath" really...English communication is difficult to me...

I want someone, an expart of the amphibia, to reseach the rule of glucose-memblane-transport of the amphibia, because there is no evidence abailable about that.
If I was an expert, I would do by myself. But I' m not.:(
 
Hi there,

You are most welcomed. It brings me great joy to see that the information has been useful.

Regarding the salt bath, it really is not indicated unless you want to treat fungal infections, so regardless isotonic or hypertonic, it really isn't the issue.

Its interesting that you want to study glucose membrane transport in amphibians. Actually frankly speaking, i would approach this at an inter and intracellular level within the amphibian's body, rather than transdermally, because as i have mentioned previously, the skin is a complex organ. It is not a simple structure like a cell.

It has been more than 10 years ago that i did cell biology, but from my distant memory, cells (even amphibian cells) have a mosaic structure that is dynamic and constantly shifting. There are ion channels, special protein structures acting like gates (i think its called clathrin), active pinocytosis and even integration of substances. Glucose itself actually invovles another big long story of the glucose phosphate pathway, krebs cycle etc. I would recommend you resarch on books on cell biology and biochemistry to find your answers. The fundamental concepts are the same, even in amphibians.

Cheers
 
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