Automation?

Adogowo

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Just curious why there seems to be a lack of automation in caudata vivariums. Does anyone have a reason why misting systems or air circulation on timers are not used as much? It is nearly standard fair for tropical frog keepers what is preventing caudata from getting in on the tech?

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Probably people don't need them? Caudate vivariums don't need to be as moist as rainforest vivariums and i think nobody wants to give $ for automation systems when they can sprinkle the terrarium manually two times a day without dying from fatigue ;)
 
Ha ha! Good point. What about the circulation do most caudates like the stale air that breeds surface fungi? Is the lack of circulation the reason it is so critical to have a sterile substrate vs a biologically diverse one? I understand about parasite build-up in a nearly closed system but it seems like a better idea to have a live substrate rather than a dead one. WhY ars some thoughts along these lines?

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I am planning a cliff vivarium that will be 48" x 48" x10"-12" deep. I want to fully understand the requirements of the salamanders I intend on keeping before construction starts. I will be housing hopefully Green back salamanders (can't think of the Latin offhand). I love the cliff habitat and want to replicate it as closely as possible including caves, passages, seeps, crevices, mosses, lichens, ferns, bonsai, and fog. While I have had many terrariums and vivariums over the years this would be my most intricate to date. So can I ask for some advice on how I might satisfy the husbandry for these little cliff dwellers in a cliff vivarium? All ideas welcome I've had my share of crazy ones (so my wife says) give me what you've got. Thanks

Dan

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Cliffs sound like place exposed to wind and other humidity changes, and definetely different from a rainforest climate. I doubt there is a need of installing a misting system, perhaps only a small waterfall/creek if you have the right idea to build it.

(can't think of the Latin offhand)
You better learn Latin names, because even outside the fact that there are often more than one "common" names in English, this is an international forum and Latin names are same for every nation ;) "Firebelly newt" or "Dusky salamander" are not really precise names, for example.

Ha ha! Good point. What about the circulation do most caudates like the stale air that breeds surface fungi? Is the lack of circulation the reason it is so critical to have a sterile substrate vs a biologically diverse one? I understand about parasite build-up in a nearly closed system but it seems like a better idea to have a live substrate rather than a dead one. WhY ars some thoughts along these lines?
Most caudates live under logs, stones, moss and layers of dead foliage. I bet you can imagine how much circulation is present in such microhabitats. Fungi and soil organisms are always present there - in terrarium people just recommend that the soil is inhabited by springtails, whiteworms, Grindal worms, woodlice, white isopods etc. Parasites have nothing to do with humidity itself, they will "build up" if they have a host (a salamander) which is not treated from them. Keep on mind that not all mites are parasites - these small organisms often show up in terrariums or in food cultures but they feed on dead organic matter. The same animals sometimes eat salamander tissues - but they're not the cause, they only eat the dying tissue of a sick animal, but don't make the animal sick by themselves. It happens sometimes when our caudates get skin infections, caused by bacteria, for example.

Anyway, in a caudate terrarium a good layer of soil, bark, leaf litter and moss is a right substrate which keeps the right humidity with only sprinkling, allowing the animals to choose a place with adequate degree of moisture.
 
I use automation for everything. Lighting is controlled via the pc using old X10 technology. I am working on developing a heating humidity system controlled with a raspberry pi, that uses a weather webservice to set the specific cage to the weather of the land of origin.
 
Well, only thing about automation i'd need would be a system which could control shortening the lighting day throughout the seasons of the year.
 
I was on my phone on the last post and couldn't look up the Latin. The name of my prospective salamander is Aneides aeneus . These guys according to natural history of the areas they live in go through many a foggy night from the forests surrounding them. As the trees draw water through their roots up the trunk to the leaves and release the moisture into the air. The passive exchange of gases when all this occurs is the kind of air movement I was wanting to replicate. Also the enclosure would provide multiple hiding places where adequate humidity and cool temperatures would allow for thermo and moisture regulation by the animal. It just seems wrong to me to put these animals into a Viv that is static and motionless and expect them to breed for us and act normal. Recreating a natural Viv is fun for me and better psychologically for the salamander. Thanks for pointing out the the micro fauna's role in the terrarium. Do you think the stream along the bottom of the cliff would provide a retreat site for the sals?

I have automated as much as possible on my Viv too. Lighting is simple appliance timers and so is the humidifier. It sounds like your setup is much more tech savvy than mine is. I always thought it would be amazing to upload a program onto a flash drive with the weather for a year and run it through an Arduino to control the lights temp humidity rain and wind cycles. Do you circulate the air in your vivs? (Circulate vs ventilate move inside air around vs draw outside air inside.) thanks again for comments on this yahilles and ominojacu.
 
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