Caudates in Croatia

Jennewt

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I recently returned from a trip in early June to visit relatives and do some sightseeing in Croatia. I'll boil this down to 4 sightings of caudates.

1. Lissotriton vulgaris pond, central Croatia.
I stumbled upon this pond, and a quick look immediately revealed a newt in the water. I didn't have time to look further, but returned the next day with net and camera. Alas, the substrate of the pond was a very thick layer of branches and beech tree leaves. Although I saw several newts, usually as they came to the surface to breathe, I was unable to catch any nor to get any decent photos of them. Every time I tried, the newt would dart down under the beech leaves. I saw them closely enough to be sure they were L. vulgaris. I saw both sexes, and the male had high fins indicative of breeding condition. Here is a habitat shot, that's the best I could do.
jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16539-l-vulgaris-habitat.jpg


2. Salamandra larvae, north-central Croatia.
I found S. s. salamandra larvae in exactly the same place I found them 2 years ago. In addition, I found them in several other locations where we hiked. They seem to like streams with moving water, and they hide under leaves right along the edge of the stream. I also saw one right inside the source of a spring (inside a human-built box enclosing the spring); this surprised me, as it seems an unlikely place for the larva to find food. I looked in many places where there was standing water, and didn't find them in such places.
jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16569-catching-s-s-salamandra-larvae.jpg


jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16540-s-s-salamandra-larva.jpg


jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16541-s-s-salamandra-larva.jpg


3. S. s. salamandra adults, north-central Croatia.
In the area where I found the larvae, I hunted for adults of course. But either they weren't nearby, or else the substrate provided them with too many hiding places. This area has a limestone base which has zillions of crack and crevices, where I imagine they can hide and not be found. Luckily, as we hiked in another area nearby, we stumbled upon some Salamandra that were obliging enough to simply appear in the middle of the hiking trail! Here are some habitat and critter shots. I was surprised that they were found in an area where the terrain is so rugged. From where many of the salamanders were seen, they would have to climb up or down steep cliffs in order to go anywhere!
jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16563-s-s-salamandra-habitat-north-central-croatia.jpg


jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16567-s-s-salamandra-north-central-croatia.jpg


This one had a stumpy tail:

jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16568-s-s-salamandra-north-central-croatia.jpg


This one was the most colorful we saw. It was rather far from the trail, hence the poor photo. It was yellow-orange.

jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16545-s-s-salamandra-north-central-croatia-most-brightly-colored-individual-we-saw-orangey-color-true-life-poor-location-getting-decent-photo.jpg


4. Unknown newt eggs, north-central Croatia.
On another hike, I noticed this old limestone livestock trough, and went for a quick look.

jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16548-old-limestone-trough-livestock-where-newt-eggs-were-found-north-central-croatia.jpg


Inside the trough, there was some moss...

jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16549-old-limestone-trough-livestock-where-newt-eggs-were-found-north-central-croatia.jpg


And on that moss, I saw something strangely familiar...

jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16550-old-limestone-trough-livestock-where-newt-eggs-were-found-north-central-croatia.jpg


Yes, definitely newt eggs!

jennewt-albums-croatia-june-2011-picture16547-newt-egg-unknown-species-north-central-croatia.jpg


Unfortunately, I was pressed for time, as certain family members were anxious to move on (hmmmfff!:mad:). I had my net with me, and tried some swipes through the trough to catch the newts that might be there, but only dredged up some decaying leaves. These newts shall have to remain "unknown". Based on range maps, the possible newt species in this area are L. vulgaris, I. alpestris, and Triturus carnifex.
 
Very interesting, thanks for sharing. Shame on the people who put you under pressure to move on in places like these. (I would have to put both a smiley and a frowney after that statement... which equals nothing I guess.)
 
awesome! As for Salamandra larvae loving running water, I made the same observation in Germany for S.s. terrestris. I only ever found them in slow-moving forest creeks, never in ponds. And I've found them in quite a few steep little forest gorges like the one you show - I guess the moist climate in there suits them well.


I know all about hiking with non-newt relatives. My only advice is to install them at the nearest pub behind a couple of Pilsen and then go off and do your thing by yourself :)
 
Neat looking herping. Some of the spots are simply marvelous looking.


They seem to like streams with moving water, and they hide under leaves right along the edge of the stream
I can also corroborate that. Salamandra larvae exist in fact in very good numbers in running waters. I saw diverse tipes of streams and some of them the Salamandra larvae were completely visible not under any type of cover. In fact the stream had not more than 50cm in wider sections and 5cm depth, feed with very small amounts of water. Later I've found that the stream had ceased resulting in the death of hundreds of salamandra larvae, most of them 4cm + in size.



I looked in many places where there was standing water, and didn't find them in such places.
They are also seen in very slow moving waters and even sometimes, in totally still waters, but the definitely prefer the cooler and moving water bodies to lay their larvae on, and you can understand this when you count the number of individuals / time in each biotype. Stream populations are way more massive and those in ponds/lakes.


I also saw one right inside the source of a spring (inside a human-built box enclosing the spring); this surprised me, as it seems an unlikely place for the larva to find food.
In Portuguese mountain streams, the only major inhabitants are Salamandra salamandra larvae and Rana iberica larvae and adults. So the only thing they have to eat is their own species smaller individuals and the tadpoles from the frogs. In fact there are not those many prey items for them too choose! Even aquatic insects are rare. I think they feed one those who fall and sink to the bottom. I've once discovered one big, terrestrial slug when forced the larvae to regurgitate its meal.

Btw, pitty you could not grab one of the L.vulgaris for some dorsal and belly shots... Next time...:rolleyes:
 
did you go to one of the caves with Olms? Or were you unable to drag all those relatives underground?
 
I could live the rest of my life happily on that gorge...
What a beautiful place! And the amount of mosses, ferns, liverworts and small plants that must live there would keep me entertained for ages.

Shame about the vulgaris, there is always an appetite for more vulgaris shots xD
If i had to choose a candidate for what the eggs are, i´d probably say vulgaris...the embryo seems to have a brownish tint to it.

Arf, relatives pressuring you to stop looking at treasures...that´s the story of my life. Every time i´m forced to move on from an herping spot i die a little bit inside...by my calculations i´m about 90% dead.

Thank you for sharing, Jenn, absolutely lovely pictures. I expect you had a great time :)
 
did you go to one of the caves with Olms? Or were you unable to drag all those relatives underground?

Upstream from the ravine in the photo, there's supposed to be cave that once had olms, but I'm told that the cave is nearly impossible to crawl into (and then dark inside:eek:). I'm not quite that adventurous. I did see an olm on display at a cave in Slovenia some years ago.
 
I did see an olm on display at a cave in Slovenia some years ago.

many years ago when I was about 12 my Dad took me to that cave (or another one) in Slovenia (still Yugoslavia back then) where one could see olms hanging about in a natural pond in the cave.

My Dad thought they looked like undercooked sausages and were just about the most boring things ever, but in the end he had to threaten me with permanent subterranean abandonment to pry me away from those olms.
 
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