Laser pointer fun

Tarabull

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Tara
I was playing with my cat and dog having them chase the light of a laser pointer. I accidentally shinned it into my African clawed frogs tank and they started attacking it. I decided to see if my axolotls like it. They do their stalking prey slink after it. It's pretty funny.
 
Using a laser pointer on dogs & cats can send them mad! It is not funny or cool & can lead to totally obsessive behaviour & compulsion to chase any reflection!

The laser can also do permanent damage to the very delicate retina - so not just a game!

Please don't do this again - what amuses you is actually very cruel.



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It doesn't make them mad, just playful.

And there are plenty of laser pointers on the market now, especially in pet stores, that are designed not to damage your eyes, and thus your pets' eyes.

Plus, a laser has to be pretty darn focused to actually create eye damage, and I doubt those are for sale just anywhere.

There's still a difference between laser pointer and an actual laser you know...
 
You are the one who needs to do some research on how it can affect your animals behaviour & most likely will end in obsessive behaviour that cannot be undone! So keep taking the risk because you obviously know everything!

Just because things are sold in shops does not mean it is safe for everything & everyone - sometimes common sense is not listed on the instructions - sadly due to idiots misusing items then suing manufacturers because it didn't tell them not to, we are forced to put obvious warnings on items -
can't be saved from stupidity!

It doesn't take a bright focused light or laser to do permanent damage to a retina! Why risk damage with shining lights near animals like that at all?



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Safety Recommendations for Laser Pointers.

The use of laser pointers has become widespread. The pointers are useful tools for educators in the classroom and at conventions and meetings. However, due to the low cost and ubiquitous supply, these pointers are now being purchased and used by the general public, including children, and used in ways not intended by the manufacturers. As a result, serious concerns about the hazards of laser pointers have surfaced.

While the majority of the laser pointers contain low to moderately powered diode lasers, more powerful lasers can be found on the market, usually imported from other countries. These pointers present a significant potential for eye injury and are often not properly labeled according to FDA regulations.

There are currently no restrictions for purchasing laser pointers in the United States. The FDA hasissued a warning for laser pointers, urging that the pointers be used as intended, not as toys, and not by children unless under adult supervision. The full text of the FDA warning is included as Appendix A.

Types of Laser Pointers

The majority of the laser pointers used in the U.S. have either Class 2 lasers with a maximum power output of less than 1 mW or Class 3R diode lasers in the 630-680 nm wavelength (red), with a maximum power output of between 1 and 5 mW.

There have been reports of more powerful laser pointers imported from Russia and China that lack the appropriate warning labels. Some of these lasers emit green beams from frequency doubled Nd:YAG lasers operating at 532 nm and have emissions significantly exceeding the maximum permissible exposure (as per the ANSI laser standard, Z136). One of the lasers has a filter in the cap, which, if removed, allows the laser to emit both 532 nm and 1064 nm beams, in excess of 15 mW, making it an even more hazardous Class 3b laser.

All laser pointers should have a small sticker on them with either a yellow "Caution" or black and red "Danger" insignia, the laser classification (2 or 3R), the maximum output power (in milliwatts mW) and the wavelength. It is prudent not to purchase or use unlabeled laser pointers.

Potential Hazards

The hazards of laser pointers are limited to the eye. Although with most visible lasers, the largest concern is potential damage to the retina, most laser pointers are not likely to cause permanent retinal damage.

The most likely effects from exposure to viewing the beam from a laser pointer are afterimage, flashblindness and glare. Flashblindness is temporary vision impairment after viewing a bright light. This is similar to looking directly at a flashbulb when having a picture taken. The impairment may last several minutes.

Afterimage is the perception of spots in the field of vision. This can be distracting and annoying, and may last several minutes, although there have been reports of afterimages lasting several days.

Glare is a reduction or complete loss of visibility in the central field of vision while being exposed to the direct or scattered beam. This is similar to viewing oncoming headlights on a dark night. Once the beam is out of the field of vision, the glare ceases. While this does not pose a hazard to the eye, it can cause serious distraction and outrage. Glare can be exacerbated when the beam is reflected from a mirror-like surface.

Laser Pointer Accidents and Incidents

As laser pointers become more ubiquitous, more and more laser pointer related incidents have been reported worldwide. Most of the reports do not concern eye exposure, but outrage. For example, police officers have reportedly drawn their weapons when the light from laser pointers is mistaken for a gun sight. Laser beams projected into airspace and intercept aircraft have caused distractions and temporary vision impairment to pilots.

Several individuals have reported temporary blindness when targeted by a number of laser pointers. This is becoming more prevalent at sporting events. A few individuals complained of afterimages lasting several days.

A high school cheerleader reported being exposed at least three times. After the last episode, she reported first seeing "green", then experiencing partial vision loss, which lasted for several months. An ophthalmic exam found no retinal damage.

Safety Considerations

Laser pointers are effective tools when used properly. The following considerations should be observed when using laser pointers:

Never look directly into the laser beam.
Never point a laser beam at a person.
Do not aim the laser at reflective surfaces.
Never view a laser pointer using an optical instrument, such as binocular or a microscope.
Do not allow children to use laser pointers unless under the supervision of an adult.
Use only laser pointers meeting the following criteria
Labeled with FDA certification stating "DANGER: Laser Radiation" for Class 3R lasers or "CAUTION: Laser Radiation" for Class 2 pointers.
Classified as Class 2 or 3R according to the label. Do not use Class 3b or 4 products.
Operates at a wavelength between 630 nm and 680 nm.
Has a maximum output less than 5 mW, the lower the better.
For more information

Contact Robin Izzo at rmizzo@princeton.edu or 258-6259.

Appendix A

FDA Issues Warning on Misuse of Laser Pointers

The Food and Drug Administration is warning parents and school officials about the possibility of eye damage to children from hand-held laser pointers.

These products are generally safe when used as intended by teachers and lecturers to highlight areas on a chart or screen. However, recent price reductions have led to promotion and use of these products as children's toys.

The light energy that pointers can aim into the eye can be more damaging than staring directly into the sun. Federal law requires a warning on the product label about this potential hazard to the eyes.

" These laser pointers are not toys. Parents should treat them with appropriate care," said FDA Lead Deputy Commissioner Michael A Friedman, M.D. "They are useful tools for adults that should be used by children only with adequate supervision."

The FDA's warning is prompted by two anecdotal reports it has received of eye injury from laser pointers -- one from a parent, the other from an ophthalmologist.
Momentary exposure from a laser pointer, such as might occur from an inadvertent sweep of the light across a person's eyes, causes only temporary flash blindness. However, even this can be dangerous if the exposed person is engaged in a vision-critical activity such as driving.

......
Source
http://web.princeton.edu/sites/ehs/labpage/laserpointersafety.htm

......




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First off I didn't join this forum for you to throw things at me without me asking for your opinion.

Second I have never shined the laser pointer in any eyes.

Third my animals maybe play with it once a month so it isn't an obsessive thing. My dog carries her ball around everywhere & sleeps with it but I haven't seen anything recalling balls for their obsessive behavior over it.
 
Tara, a forum is where people go to express their opinions. It's the nature of the beast. People here feel very strongly about salamanders.

I would highly recommend against using a laser pointer 1.) in an aquatic setup where the light can refract at weird angles, and 2.) with animals that have no eyelids to protect them from bright lights.
 
First off I didn't join this forum for you to throw things at me without me asking for your opinion.

Second I have never shined the laser pointer in any eyes.

Third my animals maybe play with it once a month so it isn't an obsessive thing. My dog carries her ball around everywhere & sleeps with it but I haven't seen anything recalling balls for their obsessive behavior over it.

Firstly ....
You've posted your experience on a public forum & have put it forward as though its entertaining fun!

This forum has many younger people on it who may well read & like your post, then go & try the same thing - my preference is to not encourage behaviour that is not safe to animals, even if the risk is tiny - no risk is a far better goal than any minor risk exposure!

Secondly...
As stated in the information I provided from Princeton & pointed out to you by Kaysie - pointing a laser through a glass aquarium will cause the light to refract at all angles, add to that the water column will also cause the light pointer to not be a direct point any more... Without eyelids an axolotl cannot evade or escape the light & in my humble opinion this is bordering on animal cruelty.

There are many other ways of keeping yourself entertained without using your animals...



<3 >o_o< <3
 
I too would advise deep caution before using a laser pointer for anything other than a lecture presentation, taking care to point it at the screen. I also use a green laser for star pointing and do not point at planes (you can end up in jail if you do!)

There is no difference between a laser pointer and a laser, there is no special lens at the front, just a very tight beam of visible (and with the green ones also if badly constructed, infrared) light. The focusing is in the eye, and the front surface and lens of the eye focuses this parallel beam down to a minute retina burning spot,. There is potential for tiny little retina burns as the retina is backed by black pigment. Following burns, which are used by eye doctors to treat various conditions, including detached retinas and diabetic retionopathy it is known the brain then fills in and ignores the gaps, the person is not aware of the holes in their vision until they are very badly affected, just as most people are unaware of the huge hole in their visual field due to the optic nerve.

The corner of tanks and water surface risk reflections back at you. Please be careful - lasers are fascinating and useful but their dangers are real and often downplayed.

Nikki71 has given links to good American guidelines, in the UK there are supposed to be limits on the power of lasers easily available as pointers but I believe the one I bought for only £5 for star pointing exceeds its declared rating and is a pretty dangerous beast if abused. I would not want its beam in my eyes. Please be careful.

Having given this long rant, I too have played with lasers, a weak red laser played on an ignored particle of food gets axies to it double fast, (I wanted to know if axies could see red-they can) but they get there anyway without it so keep the laser in its case!
 
I wouldn't exactly use a laser pointer on an aquarium either, I'll agree on that.
As for using it on my cats, our laser pointer is quite weak to be honest.
But even then I NEVER aim for any creature's eyes. That's just mean. And at home we honestly barely even use the thing. We have two boxes full of toys and a bunch of scratch poles for our cats, they can have their pick of that :p

And the only thing my cats are TRULY obsessing over is catnip ;)
My axos obsess over food of course. And hides. Hehe.

But to get back to the main thing Nikki said, I thought pet shops weren't allowed to sell strong laser pointers... at least in Belgium.
 
I've seen 2 first-hand examples of obsessive behavior over laser toys in animals. One was a cat who belonged to a friend, would literally attack my ex's legs every time we walked in the door, expecting the laser. And my own dog will frantically scratch at the drawer where the laser used to be kept from time to time, even though we very rarely let him play with it (he gets obsessive about toys easily).
 
Well, alright, in that case I agree with you. But like I said, my cats don't obsess over it... just over catnip :cool:
 
As with all items that are supposed to be regulated - there will always be people that try & sell anything without it being an item that meets standards.

With all the cheaply available lasers being made in china - they've been tested & exceed most standards - some quite dangerously so. Unless you know for certain that the laser you have is made to standards so as not to be dangerously bright, then it's best to treat all as potentially dangerous.

Glad you finally got the point I was initially trying to make :) stick to catnip



<3 >o_o< <3
 
Safety Recommendations for Laser Pointers.

The use of laser pointers has become widespread. The pointers are useful tools for educators in the classroom and at conventions and meetings. However, due to the low cost and ubiquitous supply, these pointers are now being purchased and used by the general public, including children, and used in ways not intended by the manufacturers. As a result, serious concerns about the hazards of laser pointers have surfaced.

While the majority of the laser pointers contain low to moderately powered diode lasers, more powerful lasers can be found on the market, usually imported from other countries. These pointers present a significant potential for eye injury and are often not properly labeled according to FDA regulations.

There are currently no restrictions for purchasing laser pointers in the United States. The FDA hasissued a warning for laser pointers, urging that the pointers be used as intended, not as toys, and not by children unless under adult supervision. The full text of the FDA warning is included as Appendix A.

Types of Laser Pointers

The majority of the laser pointers used in the U.S. have either Class 2 lasers with a maximum power output of less than 1 mW or Class 3R diode lasers in the 630-680 nm wavelength (red), with a maximum power output of between 1 and 5 mW.

There have been reports of more powerful laser pointers imported from Russia and China that lack the appropriate warning labels. Some of these lasers emit green beams from frequency doubled Nd:YAG lasers operating at 532 nm and have emissions significantly exceeding the maximum permissible exposure (as per the ANSI laser standard, Z136). One of the lasers has a filter in the cap, which, if removed, allows the laser to emit both 532 nm and 1064 nm beams, in excess of 15 mW, making it an even more hazardous Class 3b laser.

All laser pointers should have a small sticker on them with either a yellow "Caution" or black and red "Danger" insignia, the laser classification (2 or 3R), the maximum output power (in milliwatts mW) and the wavelength. It is prudent not to purchase or use unlabeled laser pointers.

Potential Hazards

The hazards of laser pointers are limited to the eye. Although with most visible lasers, the largest concern is potential damage to the retina, most laser pointers are not likely to cause permanent retinal damage.

The most likely effects from exposure to viewing the beam from a laser pointer are afterimage, flashblindness and glare. Flashblindness is temporary vision impairment after viewing a bright light. This is similar to looking directly at a flashbulb when having a picture taken. The impairment may last several minutes.

Afterimage is the perception of spots in the field of vision. This can be distracting and annoying, and may last several minutes, although there have been reports of afterimages lasting several days.

Glare is a reduction or complete loss of visibility in the central field of vision while being exposed to the direct or scattered beam. This is similar to viewing oncoming headlights on a dark night. Once the beam is out of the field of vision, the glare ceases. While this does not pose a hazard to the eye, it can cause serious distraction and outrage. Glare can be exacerbated when the beam is reflected from a mirror-like surface.

Laser Pointer Accidents and Incidents

As laser pointers become more ubiquitous, more and more laser pointer related incidents have been reported worldwide. Most of the reports do not concern eye exposure, but outrage. For example, police officers have reportedly drawn their weapons when the light from laser pointers is mistaken for a gun sight. Laser beams projected into airspace and intercept aircraft have caused distractions and temporary vision impairment to pilots.

Several individuals have reported temporary blindness when targeted by a number of laser pointers. This is becoming more prevalent at sporting events. A few individuals complained of afterimages lasting several days.

A high school cheerleader reported being exposed at least three times. After the last episode, she reported first seeing "green", then experiencing partial vision loss, which lasted for several months. An ophthalmic exam found no retinal damage.

Safety Considerations

Laser pointers are effective tools when used properly. The following considerations should be observed when using laser pointers:

Never look directly into the laser beam.
Never point a laser beam at a person.
Do not aim the laser at reflective surfaces.
Never view a laser pointer using an optical instrument, such as binocular or a microscope.
Do not allow children to use laser pointers unless under the supervision of an adult.
Use only laser pointers meeting the following criteria
Labeled with FDA certification stating "DANGER: Laser Radiation" for Class 3R lasers or "CAUTION: Laser Radiation" for Class 2 pointers.
Classified as Class 2 or 3R according to the label. Do not use Class 3b or 4 products.
Operates at a wavelength between 630 nm and 680 nm.
Has a maximum output less than 5 mW, the lower the better.
For more information

Contact Robin Izzo at rmizzo@princeton.edu or 258-6259.

Appendix A

FDA Issues Warning on Misuse of Laser Pointers

The Food and Drug Administration is warning parents and school officials about the possibility of eye damage to children from hand-held laser pointers.

These products are generally safe when used as intended by teachers and lecturers to highlight areas on a chart or screen. However, recent price reductions have led to promotion and use of these products as children's toys.

The light energy that pointers can aim into the eye can be more damaging than staring directly into the sun. Federal law requires a warning on the product label about this potential hazard to the eyes.

" These laser pointers are not toys. Parents should treat them with appropriate care," said FDA Lead Deputy Commissioner Michael A Friedman, M.D. "They are useful tools for adults that should be used by children only with adequate supervision."

The FDA's warning is prompted by two anecdotal reports it has received of eye injury from laser pointers -- one from a parent, the other from an ophthalmologist.
Momentary exposure from a laser pointer, such as might occur from an inadvertent sweep of the light across a person's eyes, causes only temporary flash blindness. However, even this can be dangerous if the exposed person is engaged in a vision-critical activity such as driving.

......
Source
Safety Recommendations for Laser Pointers

......




<3 >o_o< <3

WOW someone actually gave bad reputation feedback for this!

How was posting documented information from Princeton a bad thing?

I'm thinking the feedback & rep is not just from moderators - it should be! IMHO
 
WOW someone actually gave bad reputation feedback for this!

How was posting documented information from Princeton a bad thing?

I'm thinking the feedback & rep is not just from moderators - it should be! IMHO

& no I really don't care about rep points!

To be honest I accidentally found a page of readouts while exploring the Caudata site on my iPad.





<3 >o_o< <3
 
WOW someone actually gave bad reputation feedback for this!

How was posting documented information from Princeton a bad thing?

I'm thinking the feedback & rep is not just from moderators - it should be! IMHO

Nowt so queer as folk I guess!
 
Using a laser pointer to play with a dog or cat does not cause obsessive behavior if done properly and with a well-trained animal. The same can be said about any animal toy. Even if the animal hasn't displayed "obsessive" toy behavior before, if the laser pointer isn't used and reinforced properly it can result in "obsessive" behavior. This is the owner's fault, not the animal's fault.

With any toy, the owner must be able to start and stop play time whenever they feel the animal is being overstimulated. If your dog/cat is properly trained, this shouldn't be a problem. This can be achieved by giving a firm "no" and ignoring the cat/dog when they insist on playing and then only playing with the pointer when the animal isn't begging and is behaving. This way, they associate play time with being well behaved and not with begging or freaking out. If the animal is freaking out, this is the owner's fault.

Also, the entire concept of the laser pointer as an animal toy is that the animal follows it. It should never be directed at the animal in any way. This is (of course) dangerous. And I wouldn't recommend the pointer with any fish/amphibian/reptile/rodent. They have sensitive eyes and the light will stress them.
 
Using a laser pointer to play with a dog or cat does not cause obsessive behavior if done properly and with a well-trained animal. The same can be said about any animal toy. Even if the animal hasn't displayed "obsessive" toy behavior before, if the laser pointer isn't used and reinforced properly it can result in "obsessive" behavior. This is the owner's fault, not the animal's fault.

With any toy, the owner must be able to start and stop play time whenever they feel the animal is being overstimulated. If your dog/cat is properly trained, this shouldn't be a problem. This can be achieved by giving a firm "no" and ignoring the cat/dog when they insist on playing and then only playing with the pointer when the animal isn't begging and is behaving. This way, they associate play time with being well behaved and not with begging or freaking out. If the animal is freaking out, this is the owner's fault.

Also, the entire concept of the laser pointer as an animal toy is that the animal follows it. It should never be directed at the animal in any way. This is (of course) dangerous. And I wouldn't recommend the pointer with any fish/amphibian/reptile/rodent. They have sensitive eyes and the light will stress them.

I'm not sure you read the article linked to earlier in the thread..

Given the amount of poorly trained dogs that are owned in this world I would never recommend not condone the use of any laser pointer.

Lasers are not toys & there is no reason that we HAVE to use them - therefore it's best for the animals wellbeing to avoid unnecessary exposure to anything that potentially MAY harm them or cause obsessive behaviour.

Some well trained dogs still have the potential to become obsessed - those with very high prey drives can easily become obsessed with the hunt, and even with the very best trainers, some dogs will be difficult to curb obsessive behaviour.

By the way - some people consider their dog "well trained" if it sits on command every now & then. I see dogs off leash every day with zero recall to their owner & as I tend to walk 2 Dobermanns (both obedience / schutzhund trained) & I spend my walks kicking away dogs of all sizes (my arms are full of dobermanns!) who are not trained & aren't returning to their owns panicked calls.

The fact that your statement is...
Does not cause obsessive behaviour if done properly

It's the "if done properly" part that will be missed by those who will use the statement to justify their continued use a laser pointer.

Dog & cat eyes are also sensitive and it's best avoided exposing them to such bright powerful light.

Just thought I'd add my 2c again.




<3 >o_o< <3
 
Using a laser pointer to play with a dog or cat does not cause obsessive behavior if done properly and with a well-trained animal. The same can be said about any animal toy. Even if the animal hasn't displayed "obsessive" toy behavior before, if the laser pointer isn't used and reinforced properly it can result in "obsessive" behavior. This is the owner's fault, not the animal's fault.

With any toy, the owner must be able to start and stop play time whenever they feel the animal is being overstimulated. If your dog/cat is properly trained, this shouldn't be a problem. This can be achieved by giving a firm "no" and ignoring the cat/dog when they insist on playing and then only playing with the pointer when the animal isn't begging and is behaving. This way, they associate play time with being well behaved and not with begging or freaking out. If the animal is freaking out, this is the owner's fault.

Also, the entire concept of the laser pointer as an animal toy is that the animal follows it. It should never be directed at the animal in any way. This is (of course) dangerous. And I wouldn't recommend the pointer with any fish/amphibian/reptile/rodent. They have sensitive eyes and the light will stress them.

Also I'm yet to meet a well trained cat!

Or a cat that is open to training :eek:

lol - so what's your theory to stop obsession in cats, given the pointers are often sold as cat toys?



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