Otocinclus Compatibility

[dannyyyallenn]

Hey, I was wondering how some Otocinclus(dwarf suckers) would do with alpine newts in cold water. Now before the slamming comments come, I have indeed read other threads about otocinclus with axolotls and such and have also read about various unfortunate situations that resulted from species mixing. I do care about my newts. This is mostly hypothetical.

I have a 20 gallon long aquarium, heavily planted, with nutrient rich substrate (a layer of flourite and a layer of Mr. Aqua aquarium soil). I have never had problems with my nitrogen or oxygen cycle. Currently I have three alpine newt juveniles that are growing rapidly, feeding primarily on gut-loaded bloodworms but occasionally a blackworm treat from the culture I started. I also have one Chinese mystery snail and a crew of red cherry shrimp and ghost shrimp all on clean up duty.

My aquarium has been going for a bit over two months now and I'm beginning to have a brown algae issue. This is due to excess nutrients as some of my plants are still establishing themselves(primarily my S. repens carpet). The tank never has left over food or other crud at the bottom and no other variations of algae. Only brown algae(diatoms), which is beginning to fog up the glass. I could, of course, clean the glass myself, but it would be nice to have an ecosystem that can care/clean itself.(I still do water changes every other week). I've heard from several sources that otocinclus are some of the best algae eaters and they are relatively small(2" at the most). They would be a bit smaller than the newts but certainly too big to fit in their mouths. I know otocinclus are tropical fish, but one species, otocinclus affins, does inhabit areas that can ice over at some times in the year. The only problem I can think of when adding some otocinclus is that they would be uncomfortable in the winter time when I allow my tank to drop down to the mid fifties(F). I can see the problem with an otocinclus's spines and a larger caudate eating one, but that would hardly be a problem with my newts. They are rarely able to catch even the shrimp in the tank.
What are your thoughts on adding some otocinclus to my tank? Has anyone else done it with small newts and had problems? As a note, they are a non-aggressive fish and do not suck onto other animals.

 

[Daimler]

You know what is it the real problem of the fish?

pathogens

And im not joking, its an hell without end.
Fungus, virus, bacteria and protozoa are the 4 horsemen of the Apocalypse.
Never ever put fish with newt.

The brown algae finish to grow when i put the neon more distant from the surface, how much neon are you using?

 

[dannyyyallenn]

Neon? As in lighting? I have one of the National Geographic aquarium lights; its LED. I'm not sure what the wattage is for that type of LED. I have the light resting right over my tank to help the plants grow. As far as I've read, brown algae will thrive with or without lighting. I knew fish can carry some worms, but if they really are that huge of a housing for pathogens I guess that would be bad. Even with a quarantine?

 

[Daimler]

Neon? As in lighting? I have one of the National Geographic aquarium lights; its LED. I'm not sure what the wattage is for that type of LED. I have the light resting right over my tank to help the plants grow. As far as I've read, brown algae will thrive with or without lighting. I knew fish can carry some worms, but if they really are that huge of a housing for pathogens I guess that would be bad. Even with a quarantine?

Well, a quarantine of 40 days will be great, because if the fish has any problem it would be already dead (or save with the medicine).
For what i read here and in other forum the best anti-algae is the caridina multidentata, really better then fish and with minimum risk of pathogens (but if i buy them, they do the quarantine)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caridina_multidentata

also the neocaridina are very good

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_shrimp

i don't talk about snails because when they are in great number they can attack the plants.
Also the fish like pleco eat not only algae but also plants.

 

[Daimler]

PS

If your LED are full spectrum... well you have the best light that an aquarium can have.

and for what i know, full spectrum led start from a minimum of 80-128 watt

 

[dannyyyallenn]

Yes, Neocaridina Heteropoda and Multidentata are both good algae eaters. I have Heteropopa currently as well as ghost shrimp. They just don't eat enough to make a visual difference in the tank in terms of algae. Other junk, they do eat. Neocaridina Multidentata, also known as amano shrimp, are better at eating algae, but they have a complex life cycle so I wouldn't be able to breed them in my tank and due to their cost I could only buy a few. $5.00, or five US dollars for one shrimp would only allow me for 6 or so if without spending too much money and 6 shrimp in a 20 gallon tank just won't get the job done. Some snail variations do indeed eat plants but not Cipangopaludina chinensis(mystery snails), they feed primarily on algae and detritus but again, one snail can't get the job done.
And thanks for tips on the lighting. My light includes blue and white rays so it does have a full spectrum. The blue is primarily for coloration I believe.
If I did happen to buy a fish, I would make sure the store had it for at least a month beforehand.

 

[dannyyyallenn]

Also, mystery snails give live birth a few at a time and tend not to overpopulate a tank.

 

[Rupert]

Unless you manage to deal with the real cause of algae a single or a pair of ottos won't make a difference either.

Different types of algae grow based on different nutrients in the tank. Nutrient imbalance in the tank will stop the growth of other plants, but allow the algae that thrives on a specific nutrient to thrive. If the nutrients in your tank is balanced, the plants should be able to out-grow the algae and a few snails/shrimps should be able to deal with any few that do manage to grow.

I've seen hobbyists with newts and fish with no problem whatsoever (probably from good quarantine practice) - but trust me, a single otto will not clean the entire tank of algae if your tank continues to fuel algae growth. Not to mention algae eaters are often picky with what algae they eat too. If it was so convenient as to dropping in a few fish&shrimps to completely rid algae, NOBODY would have to be stressed from algae.

Deal with the cause of the problem(search on google for the specific algae to find out), THEN add the clean-up crew.

 

[Daimler]

Unless you manage to deal with the real cause of algae a single or a pair of ottos won't make a difference either.

Different types of algae grow based on different nutrients in the tank. Nutrient imbalance in the tank will stop the growth of other plants, but allow the algae that thrives on a specific nutrient to thrive. If the nutrients in your tank is balanced, the plants should be able to out-grow the algae and a few snails/shrimps should be able to deal with any few that do manage to grow.

I've seen hobbyists with newts and fish with no problem whatsoever (probably from good quarantine practice) - but trust me, a single otto will not clean the entire tank of algae if your tank continues to fuel algae growth. Not to mention algae eaters are often picky with what algae they eat too. If it was so convenient as to dropping in a few fish&shrimps to completely rid algae, NOBODY would have to be stressed from algae.

Deal with the cause of the problem(search on google for the specific algae to find out), THEN add the clean-up crew.

I totally agree with rupert, the key is found what in your thank doesn't work well.
I search some info about your LED and well... for what i read... its cheap but not awesome.

National Geographic LED Light Review - The Planted Tank Forum

And, it is not a Full Spectrum LED.
What plants do you have in your aquarium? can you do new test for ammonia, no2, no3 and phosphorus?
For me, to solve my problem with algae i have a Full Planted Aquarium with:

ludwigia repens rubin
Phyllanthus fluitans
Ludwigia sp. 'Mini Super Red'
Alternanthera reineckii 'Mini'
Bacopa australis
Bacopa Monnieri
Hemianthus callitrichoides 'Cuba'
Murdannia keisak
Penthorum sedoides
Hygrophila Polysperma
Eleocharis Vivipara
Cabomba Aquatica
Aponogeton Crispus
Anubias nana sp bonsai
Anubias sagittae
Vallisneria spiralis
Vallisneria torta
vesicularia dubyana
nymphaea pygmaea
lemna minor

but i don't have any algae :sad:

 

[dannyyyallenn]

Okay, thanks for the input guys.
I did research two specific species of otocinclus which are known to eat brown algae in particular. I have also seen a lot of before and after pictures of tanks overrun with algae and being entirely cleaned by a group of otocinclus. Regardless, I don't think I'm at my wits end with the algae just yet. If better lighting will encourage the plants and help them use up the nutrients then I will look into it. Funny thing, I read that very same review in the planted tank forum the other day.
What lighting and substrate do you use, Daimler? I would have to hold off on buying a new light for a month or so because good ones are expensive but I'd like to know what you use.

 

[Daimler]

Okay, thanks for the input guys.
I did research two specific species of otocinclus which are known to eat brown algae in particular. I have also seen a lot of before and after pictures of tanks overrun with algae and being entirely cleaned by a group of otocinclus. Regardless, I don't think I'm at my wits end with the algae just yet. If better lighting will encourage the plants and help them use up the nutrients then I will look into it. Funny thing, I read that very same review in the planted tank forum the other day.
What lighting and substrate do you use, Daimler? I would have to hold off on buying a new light for a month or so because good ones are expensive but I'd like to know what you use.

Sorry, can't post any advice.
Punished cause i do my best, see all my post.

 

[NaterPotater]

I don't know about otocinclus with newts or salamanders, but I have had a couple of them in fish tanks. They're good little algae eaters and very cute to boot.