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Salamandra heat tolerance

Groundhog

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I have a question for John or anyone else who works with Salamandra species.

I understand that the Portuguese and North African sub-species are supposedly more heat tolerant than those from central Europe. Just how heat tolerant? While I do not keep any truly high-heat herps (e.g., varanids, uromastyx, etc.), my place does get fairly warm in summer; I do use A/C at night. I keep American hylids, lowland neotropical hylids and rhacophorids, and they handle it fine (see pic).

In contrast, my set ups were too warm for Gastrotheca, which are more montane (they got a new home!). In caudates, I have kept Tylototriton shanjing long term and they were okay--didn't like summer heat, just hung out in the Episcia. In aquatic salamandrids, my Pleurodeles and Paramesotriton were fine with regular water changes (though the ribbed newts didn't start breeding again till Fall). I suspect that Salamandra just won't tolerate low 80s for a few days. (A couple of folks I know who kept European fire salamanders stuck them in a wine frig in the summer!)

P. S. Pics are to show the herp room is a humid plant room.
 

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John

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I understand that the Portuguese and North African sub-species are supposedly more heat tolerant than those from central Europe. Just how heat tolerant? While I do not keep any truly high-heat herps (e.g., varanids, uromastyx, etc.), my place does get fairly warm in summer; I do use A/C at night. I keep American hylids, lowland neotropical hylids and rhacophorids, and they handle it fine (see pic).
It doesn't really work like that. Those types are a little more heat tolerant because of the climate where they live, but they still avoid the heat religiously by going into refuges/under ground during the day and especially in the summer. In Morocco, you can find Salamandra algira in cave systems - they are really only active on the surface during cool, damp nights (if at all) in the warmer parts of the year. If you have a room that gets above about 24°C/75°F regularly, then these may not be for you. Having said that, southerly forms will tolerate warmer days like that, provided there are cooler nights. I believe this is the primary reason that fire salamanders never took off in captivity in the US - room temperatures are just too high and most of the country is farther south than most of Europe. I would encourage you to get a temperature logger and test it out for a while - see what the temps do over a few months, and during the day and at night.
In contrast, my set ups were too warm for Gastrotheca, which are more montane (they got a new home!). In caudates, I have kept Tylototriton shanjing long term and they were okay--didn't like summer heat, just hung out in the Episcia. In aquatic salamandrids, my Pleurodeles and Paramesotriton were fine with regular water changes (though the ribbed newts didn't start breeding again till Fall). I suspect that Salamandra just won't tolerate low 80s for a few days. (A couple of folks I know who kept European fire salamanders stuck them in a wine frig in the summer!)
Yes, 80s are too high. All of the species you listed are more heat tolerant than Salamandra, although Paramesotriton vary in their tolerances. I know several people who use a wine fridge to keep their fires cooler in the summer months, but you want to get one that will let you regulate the temps into the 60s or so - if you keep them too cold in the summer I would imagine it would screw up their biorhythms for breeding. I know 1 man in the very south of Europe who keeps captive fires in outdoor terraria for most of the year, but in the summer they go into boxes in a tall wine fridge he keeps outside on a covered porch.
 

John

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I should add, when I moved to the US in 2005, I deliberately avoided acquiring fires because of the temperature concerns and the fact that AC inevitably fails. I didn't start up on them in the US until I got a basement in 2010 - even when the AC fails, a good basement will never get much over 70 in the summer.
 
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    I can't figure out how to take my readings and the ones I've done I don't know if they're even correct 🤔
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  • wolfen:
    how was the measurements taken, liquid or strip, if its liquid then you count how many drop it takes to change colour, each drop is one degree, if it is strip then you divide the number by 17.9 to get the degree.
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    Should I wash out the spray bottle I just bought for my salamander? Or should I not clean it with soap n shit first becayuse thats adding "chemicals" Just want to be safe/
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  • DinnerTheAxolotl:
    @FragileCorpse, I suggest just rinsing it out with water
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  • Captive Bread:
    @FragileCorpse do you still have the AC? Put the tank where the cold air will hit the glass (I hope its glass, wood and acrylic trap heat), this usually lovers my tank by about 5 to 6 degrees. Also what lid do you use? If its a screen lid then what helps me is to spray extra in the morning so the evaporate can cool the vivarium.
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    Another thing I am experimenting with is live plants. I want to believe live plants cool it too by moving water but that could just be me having to mist everything extra.
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    Kora has left the room.
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    Helloo can anyone help me out with my kh and gh please? I need to figure it out cause I haven't a clue..
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    @MooncakeMyDudecake, what are you having trouble with
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  • FragileCorpse:
    @Captive Bread, Glass tank, screen lid, did put him with AC and temop is great now :)
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  • FragileCorpse:
    Is there such a thing as having your himidity too high with a salamander? Mine seems to fluctuate pretty intensely between 55 and 80 for some reason
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  • FragileCorpse:
    Also I neve got a reply to whether or not my salamander needs any UV light?
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  • FragileCorpse:
    Im keeping potato bugs in a nice moist container, ive got like 30 though and now the containeris poop heaven. Do I need to clean that out? Is that bad for my little buggies? Theyre clearly eating fine based on the trillion billion poops.
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  • FragileCorpse:
    My salamander only seems to eat potato bugs :s
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  • FragileCorpse:
    ...in captivity anyway, this was a wild one that I got fined for, but they never gave me the fine and neve rcame to seize him or my tank and accessories like they said they wold :s
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    jesus sorry for typos Im very seizury today
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    dose any one have any tips/tricks for just hatched salamanders/newts
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  • salamandernewbe101:
    @FragileCorpse, Salamanders require a 10-12 hour day light cycle using an incandescent light with low levels of UVB lighting recommended. Never put your tank in direct sunlight, as the sunlight can heat the tank up too much.
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  • Skdecoteau:
    @salamandernewbe101, just hatched will probably need BBS. I highly recommend the Brine Shrimp Hatchery Dish from Brine Shrimp Direct. It's wicked easy. Can be ordered from Amazon, two day if you get the one without eggs & order the eggs separately.
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    thank you :)
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    AxolotlMama: Hey guys my axolotls left me aton of babies today +1
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