The Newts being Lizards problem

John

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...isn't helped by the fact that the second episode of season 2 of Heroes (one of the biggest TV series in the world) has a scene in a classroom where the teacher tells the kids that newts are lizards.
 
I saw that too and I have to admit, I really like Heroes, but that moment really irked me. Way too many ignorant people have that impression that newts are just "water lizards".
 
I recently (the past month or two) saw an ad in a kayaking magazine that had a few wildlife species highlighted and had a picture of a marbled newt which was cool, but it identified it as a spotted salamander. I think it was for a sandal company. You would think that something, whether it be a tv show or an ad would have even the most basic info correct. All it takes is a extremely quick search on the internet. I have even heard a reputable syndicated talk show host call a crested newt a lizard.

Oh well.
 
Re: The Newts being Lizards - historical problem

Well, even though they should know better between newts and lizards ... they're not the first to make the error ...

“The term ‘salamander’ can be traced back to a Greek term which means ‘fire lizard’.” p.2

“Until about 1880, newts were classified as reptiles. Before this times, the term ‘newt’ and its earler derivatives were consequently used to describe either true newts or certain lizards.” p.4

Griffiths, Richard, A. Newts and Salamanders of Europe. Academic Press, London UK, 1995

And while I have your kind attention ... I'll segue into another newt-in-popular-TV reference:

Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Out of my Mind (Season 5, Episode 4).
- WILLOW: Hey! (looking around) Oh, wow, this place looks great. Oh, I feel like a witch in a magic shop. (picks up a jar from a table) Ooh. Are these real newt eyes? (Looks at Giles)
- GILES: No, too ... rich for my blood, I'm afraid. No, these are salamander eyes, it's the ... cataracts which give them their newt-like appearance. (moving past her) They're really equally effective, though, it's ... just a matter of overcoming snobberies.
- We see Buffy putting her purse down, and Xander looking at a blueprint, holding a pencil.
- XANDER: I'm telling you Giles. You gotta set up a blind taste test and prove once and for all that generic amphibian eyeballs are just as good.
- WILLOW: I don't know. If you ask me, the newt name still means something. (puts down jar and walks off)


Cheers
Wes
 
I"m working on a list of all the newt/salamander references in Harry Potter...that series comes up with some doozies!
 
I"m working on a list of all the newt/salamander references in Harry Potter...that series comes up with some doozies!
But what if one finds Harry Potter offensive? In fact, I will consider a total moratorium on Harry Potter on this web site.
 
WHAT is offensive about Harry Potter??? That's one of the most wonderful stories ever. Did you read it?
Or (like Grumpet) do you make it a point to not like anything I like? (LOL cats, Renaissance Faires, and now Harry Potter):confused:
 
Well, do I get to call you the same names I call him? Also, when I think he's being mean to me, I do things to purposely get him angry.
 
Can´t believe i missed that! i´ve got to re-watch that episode now.

By the way, Buffy is brilliant xDD
 
Well, do I get to call you the same names I call him? Also, when I think he's being mean to me, I do things to purposely get him angry.
No, no name calling here, thank you.
 
But what if one finds Harry Potter offensive? In fact, I will consider a total moratorium on Harry Potter on this web site.
He says,,,,,, with a heavy dose of sarcasm?
 
He says,,,,,, with a heavy dose of sarcasm?
See, that's how we separate the women from the girls. Thank you Jan.
 
The French (South) call the translucent/pale Geckos that often live in their homes "salamandre" and consider them to be good luck.
 
Re: The Salamandre problem

Sam;
Apparently, the French in the north of that country did not agree with their southern peers about the 'lucky-ness' of 'le salamandre' ...


The Reverend J.G. Wood (1865) quotes the following, delightfully prosy letter sent to "The Field" newspaper in 1891, which graphically illustrates the evil reputation formerly endured by the salamander.
"Returning homeward a few evenings ago from a country walk in the environs of Dieppe, I regarded in my path a strange-looking reptile which, after regarding me steadfastly for a few moments, walked slowly to the side of the road and commenced very deliberately climbing up the wall. Never having seen a similar animal, I was rather doubtful as to its properties; but reassured by its tranquil demeanor, I put my pocket-handkerchief over it, and it suffered itself to be taken up without resistance and was thus carried to my domicile. On arriving chez moi, I opened my basket to show my captive to the servants (French), when, to my surprise and consternation, they set up such a screaming and hullabaloo, that I thought they would have gone into fits.
"Oh monsieur a rafforte un source!"
"Un sourd!" cried one,
"Un sourd!" echoed another,
"Un S-O-U-R-D!!" cried they all in chorus; and then followed a succession of shrieks.
When they all calmed down into a mild sample of hysterics, they began to explain that I had brought home the most venomous animal in creation.
"Oh le vilain bete!" exclaimed one servant.
"Oh le mechant!" chimed in another, "He kills everybody that comes near him. I have known fifty people die of his bite and no remedy in the world can save them. As soon as they are bitten they gonflent, gonflent and keep on swelling till they burst, and they are dead in a quarter of an hour".
Here, I transferred my curiosity from the basket to a glass jar and put a saucer on the top to keep it safe.
"Oh monsieur, don't leave him so; if he puts himself in a rage, nothing can hold him. He has got so much force that he can jump up to the ceiling; and whenever he fastens himself he sticks like death!!"
"Ah, its all true", cried my landlady, joining the circle of gapers. "once I saw a man in a haycart try to kill one and the bete jumped right off the ground in a bound and fastened itself on the man's face, when he stood on the haycart, and nothing could detach it till the man fell down dead!"
"Ah, c'est bien vrai" cried the first servant. "They ought to have fetched a mirror and held it up to the bete and then it would have left the man and jumped at its own image".
The end of this commotion was that while I went to enquire of a scientific friend whether there was any truth in this tissue of betises, the whole household was in an uproar, tout en emoi, and they sent for a commissionaire and an ostler with a spade and a mattock, and threw my poor bete into the road and foully murdered it, chopping it into a dozen pieces by the light of a stable lantern, and then they declared that they could sleep in peace - les miserables.
But there were sundry misgivings as to my fate and as with the Apostle Paul (on the occasion of his being bitten by a viper when shipwrecked on the island of Malta), "They looked when I should have swollen or fallen down dead suddenly": and the next morning the maids came stealthily and peeped into my room to see whether I was alive or dead, and were not a little surprised that I was not even gonfle or any the worse for my recontre with a sourd.
And so it turned out that my poor little bete that has caused such a disturbance was nothing more than a salamander - a poor, inoffensive, harmless reptile, declared on competent authority to be noways venomous. But whose unfortunate appearance and somewhat satanic livery have exposed it to obloquy and persecution.

The Rev. Wood further refers to "one of the old writers" who advises anyone who is bitten by a salamander to "betake himself to the coffin winding sheet". And adds that a sufferer from the bite of this animal "needs as many physicians as the animal has spots".
It was also believed that if a salamander crawled upon the stem of an apple tree, all the crop of fruit would be withered by its deadly presence.
These superstitious beliefs about the salamander, although no longer widespread in Europe, still persist in some rural areas where it remains an object of terror to be destroyed whenever encountered.

*Wood, J.G. Rev. (1865). The Illustrated Natural History, Vol IV. George Rutlidge & Sons, London. [As submitted by Bellings, D. (The Red House Farm, Brakefield Green, Yexham, Dereham, Norfolk, NR19 15b) in HERPTILE 11(1)]
 
Well as annoying as that mistake was give the Heroes writers a little slack. :b
They gotta churn out a decent script rather quickly and not only that but they must make constant changes so they can't exactly concentrate on the veracity of every single line especially if it's from some random character that bears no significance to the series itself.
Common knowledge for us is usually uncommon knowledge for many. :)
 
I really like that show but their science, throughout, is either weak (or mostly) plain wrong. People make fun of Star Trek's technobabble but at least in the more recent bunch of series they at least based their spiel as closely as possible on known or likely science.
 
Way too many ignorant people have that impression that newts are just "water lizards".
To make things even more complicated, in some languages newt is "water lizard". For example in my native Finnish language there is a word "vesilisko" meaning "newt". Separately "vesi" means water and "lisko" means lizard. In Swedish language they used to have term "vattenödla", again literally "water lizard". In Swedish they have started to use "vattensalamander" instead, and also in Finland there is a new proposal coming up soon to replace misleading vesilisko.
 
To make things even more complicated, in some languages newt is "water lizard". For example in my native Finnish language there is a word "vesilisko" meaning "newt". Separately "vesi" means water and "lisko" means lizard. In Swedish language they used to have term "vattenödla", again literally "water lizard". In Swedish they have started to use "vattensalamander" instead, and also in Finland there is a new proposal coming up soon to replace misleading vesilisko.

That's really fascinating! Thanks for sharing that with us.
 
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