Axolotl swimming frantically, water parameters seem fine

[mothEar]

My 8/9 year old axolotl has been swimming around frantically in bursts since this morning (evening here now.) He seems quite distressed, swimming with his whole body and thrashing along the walls rather than walking - it’s unusual behaviour.

About two weeks ago the cycle had almost crashed (too much filter cleaning + decaying moss ball I think) and he’s been back in for about a week after I did a series of water changes to get things back under control. He was in the fridge during this time as had been floating (stress because of the ammonia spike I assume). He was reacclimatised over four days using the guide on here. As the cycle restarts I’ve been doing extra tests and water changes to keep the levels down.

Been testing for ammonia and nitrite with liquid kits every other day and the ammonia has stayed at 0. The nitrite was at 0.5 ish this morning but is back at 0 after water changes. Nitrate is reading 0 on a test strip (don’t have a liquid test for that apart from an out of date one.)

I assumed the nitrite levels going up slightly must be the cause of what seems to be stressed behaviour but he’s continued to swim frantically despite all the parameters now being good. I also added extra seachem prime and an ammonia remover filter media when I changed the water as well as adding a big dose of filter starter bacteria (not necessarily helpful but thought it was worth a try.)

I’m at a bit of a loss as to what could be wrong now. Any suggestions welcome!

 

[axolotl nerd]

My 8/9 year old axolotl has been swimming around frantically in bursts since this morning (evening here now.) He seems quite distressed, swimming with his whole body and thrashing along the walls rather than walking - it’s unusual behaviour.

About two weeks ago the cycle had almost crashed (too much filter cleaning + decaying moss ball I think) and he’s been back in for about a week after I did a series of water changes to get things back under control. He was in the fridge during this time as had been floating (stress because of the ammonia spike I assume). He was reacclimatised over four days using the guide on here. As the cycle restarts I’ve been doing extra tests and water changes to keep the levels down.

Been testing for ammonia and nitrite with liquid kits every other day and the ammonia has stayed at 0. The nitrite was at 0.5 ish this morning but is back at 0 after water changes. Nitrate is reading 0 on a test strip (don’t have a liquid test for that apart from an out of date one.)

I assumed the nitrite levels going up slightly must be the cause of what seems to be stressed behaviour but he’s continued to swim frantically despite all the parameters now being good. I also added extra seachem prime and an ammonia remover filter media when I changed the water as well as adding a big dose of filter starter bacteria (not necessarily helpful but thought it was worth a try.)

I’m at a bit of a loss as to what could be wrong now. Any suggestions welcome!

not sure what could be wrong, but i'm just skimming through this. i would tub him with 100% water changes daily and avoid fridging. pictures could be helpful, but i'm otherwise stumped

 

[mothEar]

not sure what could be wrong, but i'm just skimming through this. i would tub him with 100% water changes daily and avoid fridging. pictures could be helpful, but i'm otherwise stumped

Thanks for replying! I’ve got him in a (room temp) tub now. I’m trying to think of anything else that might be affecting the water but really not sure so will probably just try to let the cycle get going a bit more and try reacclimatising him again in a few days or week if the readings still look good/ appear to be cycling.

 

[mothEar]

I didn’t mention that he has a new air pump and airstone after not having one previously but for the first few days of it being there he seemed very happy so I don’t think it’s related to that.

 

[axolotl nerd]

I didn’t mention that he has a new air pump and airstone after not having one previously but for the first few days of it being there he seemed very happy so I don’t think it’s related to that.

i doubt it's the pump, but could there be something on the airstone? i'm grasping at straws here, but maybe the airstone came into contact with something and started leaching chemicals when it was put in?? not sure

 

[wolfen]

you need to get a liquid nitrate test, do not use prime apart from dechlorinating water prior to adding to the tank as it locks the ammonia temporarily which then stops the bacteria from feeding on the ammonia, the compounds to watch are the nitrites and nitrates as it sounds like your bacteria colony has suffered some damage, your axolotl was probably able to cope to a degree with the ammonia spike, it is when the nitrites spiked that probably sent your axolotl into a panic, this is mainly due to not enough bacteria converting nitrites hence to need for a nitrate test to check.
use holtfreters in the tank water, the salts protect against ammonia spikes and the chlorides have been found to protect against nitrite spikes.
using an air stone in the tank assists by oxygenating the water helping your axolotl and filter bacteria.
what level did the ammonia spike at?, whilst your axolotl is tubbed add ammonia to the tank to the level it spiked at and top up daily until ammonia and nitrites are zero, the same as you would to cycle the tank but only to the spiked ammonia levels, this will regrow your bacteria colony back to how it was before the crash and hopefully shouldn't take as long as a full recycle.

 

[mothEar]

Thanks, that’s all helpful- I never really understood how prime worked with the cycle - this is actually the first time I’ve tried to use it for a nitrite spike.

I’m not sure what level the ammonia spiked at as I only had nitrite and nitrate tests so the ammonia one was done in an aquatics shop and I didn’t get the number. It was way too high but the acidity of the tank was preventing it from being fully toxic, according to the aquatics shop owner (whose axolotl experience I trust, he has years of it!)

The thing that’s puzzling me is why after the nitrite spike has been diluted and the ammonia had already been 0 for a week ish, my axolotl was still distressed. (assuming the stick test for nitrate is right - but I will try a liquid one. A side question here would be whether it matters that my liquid test kit for nitrate is out of date.) As far as I understood the presence of nitrite means that the tank is beginning to reestablish its cycle. Do you think that it is cycling but just not at its previous capacity and the bacteria need feeding more, hence adding ammonia?

 

[wolfen]

what was the ph? and what is the ph now?
as to out of date tests, they become less sensitive over time and although they may inform you of nitrogen compound presence the actual amount may be way higher.
https://ambystoma.uky.edu/genetic-s...ive/Issues-1-12/archive/Issue 11/24-26fox.pdf has info on the effects of nitrogen compounds.
if you go to Water Quality Explained: How It Can Affect Your Axolotl's Health - WSAVA 2015 Congress - VIN it has at the bottom a table of ideal and tolerable amounts, for ammonia tolerable is 2ppm where as nitrite is 0.5ppm so even at a diluted amount it can still be stressful.

 

[mothEar]

what was the ph? and what is the ph now?
as to out of date tests, they become less sensitive over time and although they may inform you of nitrogen compound presence the actual amount may be way higher.
https://ambystoma.uky.edu/genetic-stock-center/newsletters/Older_archive/Issues-1-12/archive/Issue 11/24-26fox.pdf has info on the effects of nitrogen compounds.
if you go to Water Quality Explained: How It Can Affect Your Axolotl's Health - WSAVA 2015 Congress - VIN it has at the bottom a table of ideal and tolerable amounts, for ammonia tolerable is 2ppm where as nitrite is 0.5ppm so even at a diluted amount it can still be stressful.

The pH currently is now consistently testing at 7.5. As with the ammonia levels, I don’t have an exact number on the previous level. Also I didn’t mention temperature but that’s been consistent at about 16 degrees.

Thanks, that article is one of the better explanations I’ve seen of water parameters. I understand that 0.5 is too high for nitrite however my original question was what about what was still causing issues after that had been returned to ~zero with a water change.. just to check I'm understanding you right, are you saying it could still be causing stress even if it’s not enough to show up in the test? Nitrate is still an unknown so I need to get a new test kit for that as that seems to be the main possible problem but would have thought that the water change I did to address the 0.5 nitrite reading would also have helped with nitrate. Also, although I know liquid tests are more accurate I would have thought that the strip test would give some indication of nitrate levels if they were high.

Would your suggested course of action be to buy a new nitrate kit and also to ‘feed’ the bacteria until ammonia and nitrite are 0 and the nitrate is present at a level that can be brought back down with normal water change routines?

Thanks!!

 

[wolfen]

even after a water change there may still be traces of nitrites etc.. which might be enough to stress your already stressed axolotl, bit like last straw.
your nitrites and nitrates need to be monitored as even a small amount of ammonia can produce larger amounts of nitrites etc.. ie..1ppm ammonia = 2.7ppm nitrites = 3.6ppm nitrates.
what bio-media are you using?
using bottled bacteria will help boost your bacteria colony.
with strip tests because of being inaccurate they can be seen as is there hidden nitrogen compounds that aren't being registered or are the nitrates so low that there is no nitrite to nitrate conversion happening and therefore an issue with the biological filtration.