Chinese fire belly habitat/ enclosure set up

[meowmags]

Hello! So my little guys are only two months old but I am super confused as to how to set up their tanks?

I know they can be fully aquatic but I have seen many posts of people keeping them in paludariums as well?

Can they be kept terrestial or do they prefer to have mainly water and then turn aquatic? If they are fully aquatic, can they still be held if needed using wet hands?

I have attached a picture of the tank and wood I am planning to use

 

[stanleyc]

About how large are they right now? Did you just receive them or have you had them for a while. Have you been keeping them aquatically or terrestrially so far? Chinese fire bellies can be fully aquatic very early if trained to be comfortable that way. As adults I would not keep them terrestrially. But if they are not used to being aquatic yet, you may want to provide a small area that break the surface of the water for them to rest on. Do you have any information from the seller about how they were kept prior to you purchasing them?

 

[meowmags]

About how large are they right now? Did you just receive them or have you had them for a while. Have you been keeping them aquatically or terrestrially so far? Chinese fire bellies can be fully aquatic very early if trained to be comfortable that way. As adults I would not keep them terrestrially. But if they are not used to being aquatic yet, you may want to provide a small area that break the surface of the water for them to rest on. Do you have any information from the seller about how they were kept prior to you purchasing them?

They are only two months old since I hatched so are maybe 2cm big?
As far as I know, the breeder has kept the adults fully aquatic and as they are larvae, they are currently fully aquatic

 

[Newthanial]

I advise gloves if you have them but some clean wet hands all that's really needed...It all depends on if you intend on breeding them. My cynops cyanurus had some trouble getting used to all the water but as long as you have plenty of floating plants, wood or even a large rock thats ph neutral so they can make their own choices

 

[stanleyc]

Oh sorry I thought they were morphs already. It looks like you have a land area in the setup you have right now. It will work. They will want to go on land right when they morph, but can be trained to go back into the water very quickly. You can do this by slowly raising the water level and providing food in the water. Like Newthanial said, still provide at least floating plants for them to access the air and keep the water depth pretty low to start. I would say no deeper than 3 inches to begin. I find keeping them aquatic is a lot easier than terrestrial. Feeding is easier and they're more active aquatic vs terrestrial. As far as I know, there isn't any benefit to giving H. orientalis a terrestrial phase if they are willing to go back in the water.

Also, if you do not have one already, you might want to get some kind of cover for your enclosure. They will climb the walls and try to escape. It looks like your tank has a pretty wide inside lip to it, which could help keep them in, but I wouldn't risk it.

 

[meowmags]

Oh sorry I thought they were morphs already. It looks like you have a land area in the setup you have right now. It will work. They will want to go on land right when they morph, but can be trained to go back into the water very quickly. You can do this by slowly raising the water level and providing food in the water. Like Newthanial said, still provide at least floating plants for them to access the air and keep the water depth pretty low to start. I would say no deeper than 3 inches to begin. I find keeping them aquatic is a lot easier than terrestrial. Feeding is easier and they're more active aquatic vs terrestrial. As far as I know, there isn't any benefit to giving H. orientalis a terrestrial phase if they are willing to go back in the water.

Also, if you do not have one already, you might want to get some kind of cover for your enclosure. They will climb the walls and try to escape. It looks like your tank has a pretty wide inside lip to it, which could help keep them in, but I wouldn't risk it.

Thank you! Is it possible to keep them fully terrestial? Making a paludarium as I think I'd love that idea! Still giving them inches of water but I'm planning on doing a lot of moss and terrestial plants for them to climb.

Also yes haha there will definitely be a lid

Thank you so much!

 

[meowmags]

I advise gloves if you have them but some clean wet hands all that's really needed...It all depends on if you intend on breeding them. My cynops cyanurus had some trouble getting used to all the water but as long as you have plenty of floating plants, wood or even a large rock thats ph neutral so they can make their own choices

Thank you! I was thinking of breeding them but since I only have the two babies, I'm not sure what gender they will end up being yet

 

[meowmags]

Oh sorry I thought they were morphs already. It looks like you have a land area in the setup you have right now. It will work. They will want to go on land right when they morph, but can be trained to go back into the water very quickly. You can do this by slowly raising the water level and providing food in the water. Like Newthanial said, still provide at least floating plants for them to access the air and keep the water depth pretty low to start. I would say no deeper than 3 inches to begin. I find keeping them aquatic is a lot easier than terrestrial. Feeding is easier and they're more active aquatic vs terrestrial. As far as I know, there isn't any benefit to giving H. orientalis a terrestrial phase if they are willing to go back in the water.

Also, if you do not have one already, you might want to get some kind of cover for your enclosure. They will climb the walls and try to escape. It looks like your tank has a pretty wide inside lip to it, which could help keep them in, but I wouldn't risk it.

Also, how long will it take for them to morph do you recon? They are 2 months old currently, born 25.01.24 around 2-3cm long? I'm trying to keep them at temp between 17C as my office can get to 22C

 

[stanleyc]

Yeah you can definitely keep them terrestrially or in a paludarium as morphs/juveniles. I'm not sure how long you can or should keep them terrestrial though. The only time I gave them a terrestrial phase, I think it was less than half a year before I reintroduced them back to water. This caresheet Caudata Culture Species Entry - Cynops orientalis - Chinese firebelly says "The terrestrial juveniles can take 1-3 years to reach sexual maturity." which seems to suggest it can be up to 3 years. I don't know if it's a good idea to keep them terrestrially as mature adults. But if you're doing a paludarium I'm sure you'll be able to tell when they start spending more time in the water. If and when that happens, I would say you should probably think about switching them to a fully aquatic setup or at least increasing the aquatic area and decreasing the terrestrial area of the paludarium. The land area might just be wasted space at that point.

It's been a long time since I raised larvae, so sorry I can't tell you how long it took for the larvae to morph. But if I had to guess I would say that one still has maybe a few weeks to go? If I remember correctly I think they developed some of their mature belly color and pattern before morphing, ie, yellow/orange background and black markings. It looks like yours still has a pale cream color with no black markings. But again it's been a while thoug so I could be wrong. The clearest sign that they're getting ready should be when you see the gills start to shrink and disappear. A word of warning though. I think it's possible for them to climb up onto land even before the gills fully disappear, so I would say to be safe, make sure you've got them in a covered enclosure as soon as you see the gills start receding.

 

[Newthanial]

Thank you! I was thinking of breeding them but since I only have the two babies, I'm not sure what gender they will end up being yet

This is older video but I thought she did a solid guide for orientalis