Fire ID

[paris]

can anyone tell me the subspecies of this fire?
http://market.kingsnake.com/image/thumb/331146.jpg
the ad says they are from northern italy, but they look like the S.s.s. to me -im not very good with IDing these also there is a pair of "spanish' fire sals too-would you agree that is what these are? http://market.kingsnake.com/image/330874.jpg
they claim they are "RARE" and that is probably true for the USA -but are they also hard to come by in europe?

 

[sergé]

It's is difficult to tell from just a small pic, but in northern Italy (Alpine area) you have S.s. salamandra. The other picture could be a S.s. bernardezi (or S.s.fastuosa). Both subspecies are not extremely rare in captivity and offered regularly by private breeders in Europe.

 

[travis]

Those are S.s.salamandra. I can't imagine they are very common in the US because I can't say I've ever seen Italian salamandra before....most all from Ukraine.
They are likely pretty common in Europe because they can be caught there. hehe
As far as the "spanish fire sals"...not sure looks like fatuosa...those are from a different seller though I believe.