how to know which eggs to keep?

axolotl nerd

Active member
Joined
Mar 17, 2021
Messages
354
Reaction score
91
Points
28
Location
america
Country
United States
i’m interested in breeding my axanthic (hopefully male, assuming he is for this scenario) with a golden albino (possibly mosaic or mel) and i wondered how i’ll know which eggs to keep? i’m most interested in luc (which i don’t even know ill get) and golden/albinos. i decided to ask if there was a way to tell what type the larva would be as soon as they’re laid. i’m thinking about keeping up to 30 - and culling the others as humanely as possible.

sorry if the above sounds unclear, what i mean is will i be able to look at an egg and say “thatll probably be a golden“ or “that’s an albino”?
 

JM29

Active member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
330
Reaction score
37
Points
28
Location
Brittany
Country
France
what i mean is will i be able to look at an egg and say “thatll probably be a golden“ or “that’s an albino”?
Sorry, unfortunately no. At least not just after laying.
The colour of the egg is mother-dependant (the pigments of the eggs are given by the mother).

If the mother is albino (golden or not), she'll lay white eggs. If not (wild-type, leucistic), the eggs will be dark.

When the embryo forms (or not) its own pigments, you'll be able to separate the albinos from the others.
 

axolotl nerd

Active member
Joined
Mar 17, 2021
Messages
354
Reaction score
91
Points
28
Location
america
Country
United States
Sorry, unfortunately no. At least not just after laying.
The colour of the egg is mother-dependant (the pigments of the eggs are given by the mother).

If the mother is albino (golden or not), she'll lay white eggs. If not (wild-type, leucistic), the eggs will be dark.

When the embryo forms (or not) its own pigments, you'll be able to separate the albinos from the others.
how soon should i cull them? i’d like to be able to pick the ones i want but i also don’t want to have to cull too late - id hate to cause any lifing thing pain :(
 

JM29

Active member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
330
Reaction score
37
Points
28
Location
Brittany
Country
France
I understand.
This problem is complex.
If I've really understood your precedent posts, you have an axanthic (presumably male, otherwise normally pigmented) that you'd like to cross with an albino mother.
What characters do you want to select for ?
 

axolotl nerd

Active member
Joined
Mar 17, 2021
Messages
354
Reaction score
91
Points
28
Location
america
Country
United States
I understand.
This problem is complex.
If I've really understood your precedent posts, you have an axanthic (presumably male, otherwise normally pigmented) that you'd like to cross with an albino mother.
What characters do you want to select for ?
i’ve not done a huge amount of research in the genetics of breeding, but i do hope to get a few wilds, mels, axanthic, and albinos out of the pairing. not sure how likely any of that will be though. and yes, you’re correct
 

JM29

Active member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
330
Reaction score
37
Points
28
Location
Brittany
Country
France
Well, if your axanthic male also carry albino and melanoid recessive allele, and if at the same time your melanoid albino also carry an axanthic allele, then you'll get 8 possible forms including wild-type and axanthic melanoid albino. To be sure to get all the possible colours, you'll have to keep 16 to 24 eggs just after laying.

The worst possibility is : your axanthic male doesn't carry melanoid or albino alleles, and your albino femelle doesn't carry the axanthic allele. In this case, you'll get 100% wild-types and you'll have to wait until the next generation.

There are intermediate possibilities, depending on what you know about the genetics of the parents.
 

axolotl nerd

Active member
Joined
Mar 17, 2021
Messages
354
Reaction score
91
Points
28
Location
america
Country
United States
first, you’re a huge help and thank you very much


second, the breeder told me he’s heterozygous for golden, axanthic and leucistic - his parents were mel and leucistic - his siblings are wilds, leucistics, goldens, and axanthic
 

JM29

Active member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
330
Reaction score
37
Points
28
Location
Brittany
Country
France
If his parents are melanoid and leucistic, he is definitively heterozygous for mel and leucistic.
If he has golden siblings, he has high odds (2/3) to carry the albino character, but not for sure.

Your axolotl seems to have an interesting genetic combination but it will be difficult to predict the results of the cross you are planning.

After laying, the eggs, which will be white (albino mother) will wait about 2 weeks before hatching.
The first black pigments will appear within 1 week on the back and on the eyes ; you'll be able to detect the albinos (0% or 50%).
The yellow pigments can be observed a few days before hatching (alternative yellow and black bars on wild-types).
For the melanoid character, I don't know. Observe the eyes, but I think the iridophores appear later.
 
Last edited:

JM29

Active member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
330
Reaction score
37
Points
28
Location
Brittany
Country
France
To complete the reply :
The problem with the odds is that they match well for great numbers.
Small numbers can bring some surprises.

For example :
- I once decided to keep 6 axolotls, sure to get a couple. 2 years later, I counted 5 males and 1 female.
- Yesterday I watched 13 ribbed newt eggs, from which I expected 25% leucistic ones. I obtained 11 wild-types and only 2 leucis. Then I got 7 more eggs I caught from teir parents'aquarium. Result : 4 leucis and only 3 wild-types. The total was 20, with 14 wild-types (theoretically 15) and 6 leucis (theoretically 5)

Just to say you can keep and raise a dozen of eggs. The odds of the different colours can be calculated but the real number will be a surprise.
Try to keep 2 dozens to begin.
 

axolotl nerd

Active member
Joined
Mar 17, 2021
Messages
354
Reaction score
91
Points
28
Location
america
Country
United States
To complete the reply :
The problem with the odds is that they match well for great numbers.
Small numbers can bring some surprises.

For example :
- I once decided to keep 6 axolotls, sure to get a couple. 2 years later, I counted 5 males and 1 female.
- Yesterday I watched 13 ribbed newt eggs, from which I expected 25% leucistic ones. I obtained 11 wild-types and only 2 leucis. Then I got 7 more eggs I caught from teir parents'aquarium. Result : 4 leucis and only 3 wild-types. The total was 20, with 14 wild-types (theoretically 15) and 6 leucis (theoretically 5)

Just to say you can keep and raise a dozen of eggs. The odds of the different colours can be calculated but the real number will be a surprise.
Try to keep 2 dozens to begin.
thank you so much, i’m very excited to start this process and you’ve been a wonderful help :)
 
General chit-chat
Help Users
  • No one is chatting at the moment.
  • Chat Bot:
    RobynB27 has left the room.
    +1
    Unlike
  • Lilith:
    Does anyone know if aquacare general tonic is ok for axolotls as a treatment for bacterial or fungal infection?
    +1
    Unlike
  • faebugz:
    Hi Lilith, you can check the medications page for a list of axolotl safe treatments. Although if the infection is mild, I would stick with fridge and salt baths!
    +1
    Unlike
  • faebugz:
    I believe the fridge gets to about 54°, so if you can replicate that in the tank, it might be okay. I personally would fridge just to make catching them easier, and if the infection is something in the water column at all, it will hopefully die out while they're AWOL (I'm thinking like ich for fish, not sure if axies have an equivalent)
    +1
    Unlike
  • Lilith:
    Ok, thank you!
    +1
    Unlike
  • chitoos:
    My three inch axolotl was having trouble pooping up to a few days ago. I wasn't feeding her as often because I was scared I would just add to her constipation. I fridged her until she pooped (twice), and then began to feed her around 6 bloodworms every other day. she's been pooping everyday now, but she's at that age where you can see through her stomach and I always see poop ready to come out but has not yet passed. I don't think she's constipated anymore, but I'm not sure and i don't want to over or underfeed her... any advice?
    +1
    Unlike
  • Chat Bot:
    xxianxx has joined the room.
    +1
    Unlike
  • xxianxx:
    Feed it chopped worms chitoos, its big enough and bloodworm is nutritionaly deficient.
    +1
    Unlike
  • xxianxx:
    Freeze dried , live or frozen bloodworm.
    +1
    Unlike
  • chitoos:
    Oh ok thanks! I thought she might be ready for something more. do you have any advice about the apparent poop problem?
    +1
    Unlike
  • xxianxx:
    @Lilith, fridging is not required for fungus treatment. Read my thread on treatment.
    +1
    Unlike
  • xxianxx:
    Feed it more, six bloodworm isnt much, dont use freeze dried foods
    +1
    Unlike
  • xxianxx:
    Feed daily , remove uneaten food
    +1
    Unlike
  • chitoos:
    Gotcha, Thank you!
    +1
    Unlike
  • xxianxx:
    Its probably not pooping because its hardly beign fed, it pooped in the fridge because the lower temp caused it to purge itself. If it stays constipated you can pm me
    +1
    Unlike
  • Chat Bot:
    xxianxx has left the room.
    +1
    Unlike
  • Chat Bot:
    xxianxx has joined the room.
    +1
    Unlike
  • Chat Bot:
    xxianxx has left the room.
    +1
    Unlike
  • Audrey22:
    Hi guys. Quick question. I have newly morphed eastern newt efts. They lost their gills but they still prefer the water. I have coconut fiber, moss, hidey holes and some food in the temporary habitat for them (waiting for the other newts to morph as well). But they still run back to the water. Is it the wrong substrate? Do they prefer something other than coconut fiber? I've been doing everything else properly (According to my research) but just wondering why they haven't ventured up. Have any ideas?
    +1
    Unlike
  • MVM1991:
    My guess is they simply have no reason to leave. Do they still get enough food in the water? Maybe humidity is too low?
    +1
    Unlike
  • Audrey22:
    I spray mist the place every day. And I do still feed him. One of them has finally come out. But now I have another problem. They don't look like eastern newts! I am posting pictures on a thread I've started. If you can, take a look for me and see. :)
    +1
    Unlike
  • Chat Bot:
    Herphunter has left the room.
    +1
    Unlike
  • tammyaxie:
    Hi guys. Can someone please tell me the sex of my axolotl. I thought I knew for the past four years but a breeder told me I was wrong. PayPal: Your security code is: 138208. It expires in 10 minutes. Don't share this code with anyone.
    +1
    Unlike
  • tammyaxie:
    I'm sorry, please disregard the last part. Thought I pasted a photo
    +1
    Unlike
  • Chat Bot:
    NewbieAxie has left the room.
    +1
    Unlike
    Chat Bot: NewbieAxie has left the room. +1
    Top