Newbie questions regarding Eastern Tiger Salamander care

[JimboT]

I just made my first post in the intro area so won't repeat all that info here.To make a long story short on Tuesday I acquired what I think is an Eastern Tiger Salamander. I estimate he is about 6 inches in length. That night I was able to find one small earthworm in my backyard and the next morning he ate about 2 inches of it and left the remaining 1 inch. Later that day I made a trip to the pet shop to pick up some supplies based on what I had read on the internet about caring for him. That night after work I set him up in a 5 gallon aquarium which i now understand may be too small. It has 3-4 inches of Eco Earth Coconut fiber which I am misting once daily. When I put him in the aquarium he immediately burrowed into the Eco Earth and I don't think he has been on the surface since.

My first concern is that it is now 2 and a half days since he ate the small worm portion. I offered him part of a night crawler by dangling it over the opening to his burrow. At night he sits with his head just below the surface of the burrow opening and this is when i offered the worm. He just backed down into the burrow to hide from me. So I dropped the worm piece into the opening and watched. He never ate it and it eventually wiggled its way into the fiber.

Last night I put two small crickets in the tank. I only see one now so maybe he ate one or maybe it found a place to hide? I'm not sure if I should leave him alone or be concerned that he's not eating much if at all. I would like to avoid needlessly handling him but should I uncover him and try to feed him where he cant so easily hide? I think if he wasn't so timid i might get a feeding response like I did the first morning I had him.

So what do you all think? Thanks

 

[Asevernnnn]

I would just leave it alone for awhile and let it get used to its surroundings, since its WC.
A 5 gallon is too small for this specie as they get quite large, a 10 gallon would be the minimum, which cost the same as a 5 gallon basically.
I would also add more cocofiber, I usually have a slope of 5-7 inches. And make sure its moist all the way through if you're using the bagged kind.
If its large enough, it can probably eat whole-half night crawlers, and they don't need to be cut into tiny pieces.
And I would advise against feeding crickets unless they're dusted, and that the feeding is monitored. Uneaten crickets will bite the salamander.
Whats the temperature? If its cool enough they won't have to eat every day/every other day. Some tigers will remain in burrows for weeks at a time.

 

[JimboT]

Thanks for the reply Aaron. Well before I read your post I went ahead and took him out. I probably shouldn't have done that but I was getting worried. I guess I will have to calm down. I put him in a small bucket so he couldn't just retreat into the soil. I offered him a Canadian night crawler from Meijers which is kind of a local version of Walmart. He grabbed it and swallowed all but an inch or so. I see now that while being eaten they stretch out and are longer than I first thought. Apparently it was to big for him as he quit trying to swallow it further and it eventually worked its way back out of his mouth. So I cut it in half and tried to get him to take it from my fingers or from a pair of plastic tweezers or just off the floor of the bucket but he was not at all interested. I am wondering if I need to try some other type of worm. I see that others have had problems with night crawlers. I had three crickets left from the four I picked up at the pet shop. He ate all of those. One I just put in the bucket with him. He ignored it for quite a while but it ran in front of him one to many times and he grabbed it. After that he took the other two from the tweezers. I really don't want to feed him crickets but at least i know he will eat them. If I have to feed him crickets I will have to look into dusting or gut loading them. I've never done this before. I want to try other worm types. He took the one from the backyard but we have snow now so I don't think I'll have much luck finding earthworms until spring.
He did appear to be in good shape and was quite actively trying to find a way out of the bucket. So I feel a little better knowing he is not near death. I have plenty of aquariums that I've acquired over the years so putting him in a larger one is not a problem. I just grabbed the 5 gallon from the basement because it happened to have a screened top that fit it. All the others were used for fish so have lighted hoods. But I can come up with a suitable top for any of them. I'm wondering how important it is to move him to a bigger enclosure right now given his current size. I will probably head that way since the enclosure he is in right now was thrown together quickly and is quite spartan. I don't have any hides for him because I couldn't find anything suitable so I have to do something about that. Maybe that will encourage him to spend a little time on the surface??
What do you mean by WC? Wild catch maybe. In my intro post I described how I found him. here is a link if interested:

http://www.caudata.org/forum/f1-gen...ons-area/100034-eastern-tiger-salamander.html

Does anyone know if it is actually legal in Michigan to keep him? I've looked but haven't found an answer yet. I attached a picture of him. Can anyone confirm that he is a eastern tiger? Thanks again, James

 

[RPM]

Since he ate a most of a Canadian night crawler, I would just stick with them. Cut them in half if you need, feed him the half without the bulge first that way the second half will stay alive for your next feeding. You should only have to feed him about twice a week. If he gets used to crickets, it may be difficult to get him back onto night crawlers which are a better food choice for him. If your tank is tall enough, you may not need a screen top. The 5 gallon tank set up with soil is better than the bucket as long as it is temporary. Twenty gallon long tanks are ideal for a salamander your size. What is the temp? WC is Wild Caught. If he ate most of a night crawler, a cricket or two and burrows, he sounds rather normal. He looks like Eastern Tigers that I've had in the past.

 

[Asevernnnn]

Since you're in Michigan, and its WC, Im going to say its most likely an Eastern Tiger Salamander(A. t. tigrinum), and I don't know if its legal to keep or not.
The worms that a lot of things won't take are Red Worms/Red Wigglers since they secrete stuff when cut up.
Canadian Nightcrawlers are what Ive had most success with, and I just buy mine at Walmarts, and if they're out I buy at a local petshop.
If you catch worms locally, you need to make sure the place you collect them from is free from pesticides.
And here are some links to pages about Tigers:
Caudata Culture Articles - Tiger Salamander 101
Caudata Culture Species Entry - Tiger salamander

 

[sde]

Does anyone know if it is actually legal in Michigan to keep him? I've looked but haven't found an answer yet.

They are legal to take with a valid fishing license, the daily beg limit is 10, but please, PLEASE do not take that many!
They are not on this list, which means ( in this case ) they are legal to take. The Amphibian section is on page four, and Ambystoma tigrinum tigrinum is not on the list. http://www.michigan.gov/documents/d...ngered_Species__nonstrike__9-12._274586_7.pdf

You cannot legally sell or buy them though, only for personal "use".

See also; Amphibians & Reptiles | 2014 Michigan Fishing Guide | eRegulations.com

-Seth

 

[JimboT]

Thank-you Seth that is great info. I have no intention of taking any more and I believe that whenever possible wildlife should be left in the wild. But I really thought this ones chances of survival were pretty slim under the circumstances.

Oh by the way, just to be clear the bucket was just temporary in order to feed him. He went right back into the tank after he ate the crickets. And of course he headed underground and hasn't been spotted since lol. I did have to do some unrelated digging in the yard today and came in with a couple flat rocks. I laid one so it overlaps the other and forms a small hide. I will have to wait and see if he will use it.

Oh and I also found a grub which I think I read somewhere that they like. So i'll try and give him that.

I have him in the living room which stays set at 70 deg F, 24/7. I could put him in the basement where its cooler but i'm not really sure what that temp would be. I guess I've never checked. But I kind of like having him in the living room if that temp is ok.

As for feeding night crawlers is it ok to put the cut in half worms in the cage for a while to give him a chance to find them and eat? Or should they be hand fed. My concern is the worms getting into the soil and then dying and fouling up the cage. How do you all approach that?

Oh and a top is a must for me. Not to keep him in as much as to keep our three cats out.

Thanks again, It is quite a relief to have a place where i can get my questions answered.

James

 

[Asevernnnn]

When I first got my tiger I left the worms in a non-metal dog bowl, and i would leave them in the dark and eventually it would eat the worms.

 

[sde]

Hey James,

I have him in the living room which stays set at 70 deg F, 24/7. I could put him in the basement where its cooler but i'm not really sure what that temp would be. I guess I've never checked. But I kind of like having him in the living room if that temp is ok.

The ideal temperature range is 65-72 F, with a max of 75 F. So it should be ok. Just make sure it doesn't get much higher than it is. -Seth

 

[JimboT]

I found a 20 gal tank in the basement. I didn't realize we had one. It's not a long but still should be better than the current 5.5 gal setup. And the price is right. It has a screened top also. I will start getting that ready for him tomorrow morning.

This morning when I got up it looked like he had been partying the night before. Lot's of new excavations with a lot of substrate moved around. If he is going to be active like that I can see the need for more space.

At his next feeding in a day or two I will try a few cut in half night crawlers left in a bowl overnight. but I have to get the 20 gal set up first as i really don't have much more room for the bowl.

Fun Fun:happy:

 

[JimboT]

Hello everybody. I thought I'd give a quick update on my Eastern Tiger. He (or she??) is doing quite well. In the last week he seems to have gotten quite comfortable with his new surroundings and me. At first I had to resort to digging him up to feed him because he would hide and not come above the surface to get food. I left worms in a dish for a week and he would not take them. So I dug him out after that week and got him to eat a night crawler. He was very sluggish and it took a while for him to eat it. But when I returned him to his tank, for the first time he did not immediately burrow underground and stayed on the surface for a while. I know it sounds silly but he seemed to be checking me out.

Three days later when I got home from work at about 12 midnight I noticed he was just inside the entrance to his burrow. I got half a worm and dangled it in front of him and he came right out after it. I put it down in front of him and after playing with it for a while he ate it. The next night he was out again. I offered him the second half and he ate that. Another two days brings us up to tonight and he came out about midnight again and ate both halves of a night crawler.

I am very pleased to be able to feed him without having to handle him and also without having to destroy his burrow by digging him up. He really seems to enjoy wading in his water dish. He kind of reminds me of a cat the way he plays with the worm before he eats it.

Anyway I just wanted to let you all know how it's going and say thanks again for all the good advice. I think we are over the hump so to speak.

James

 

[sde]

Good to hear he is eating and doing better!

He kind of reminds me of a cat the way he plays with the worm before he eats it.

Maybe that's why they are called "Tiger salamanders"

 

[JimboT]

Well all... "Salyman" as I call him (I know not very original) is doing well. Today I moved him into a 20 gallon long tank that I got on sale for $20. I also went with a mix of topsoil and coco-fiber for substrate to replace the straight coco-fiber I was using. I went a little longer than I probably should have before replacing the substrate. I wanted to try the topsoil mix but I couldn't get hold of any topsoil because every store I tried had the bags outside and the skids were a solid block of frozen dirt. It has finally warmed up and I was able to get a few bags from Lowes. I am hoping the topsoil coco-fiber mix will not stick to him like the straight coco-fiber did. I took a pic of him in the same bucket he was in in the picture above from back when I first got him in November. He has grown quite a bit and I guess I may be overfeeding him as he has put on a few lbs. lol.