Raising N. viridescens from eggs - why is it considered difficult

[Sawyer]

Just out of curiousity.... and sorry to semi-hijack the thread...... but what makes them so tricky to raise? I don't have any experience with them so I would be curious to know. Thanks.

 

[Jennewt]

Re: Raising N. viridescens from eggs

Rather than hijacking the thread in the advertising section, I moved it here.

 

[Sawyer]

Thanks for moving the post.......

Jennewt- I see where you said that you successfully raised them although they are a tricky species, so you must have some insight on what makes them so finicky?

 

[Jennewt]

Re: Raising N. viridescens from eggs

And in answer to the question... there is no really good answer.

One of the factors is that any newt that goes through an eft phase is difficult for most people. They need small live terrestrial food, and that is harder to provide than any other. And they need to be kept relatively dry (non-soggy), and that is a difficult concept for many newt people.

Beyond the difficulties of the eft stage, I know from my own experiences, and those I've read, that a lot of experienced newt people have them die off at any life stage, often with no obvious reason. It's a frustrating to experience, and especially frustrating that there is no obvious explanation for why they sometimes die under the best of care. It seems to be hit or miss, and a few of us have been lucky, at least some of the time. I've had both successes and failures.

 

[Sawyer]

Thanks for the explanation. Seems like it could be very frustrating, but then again there is usually something difficult and frustrating with many species that seemingly have little to no explanation.

 

[Eft Lover]

I appreciate this post; even though I have read of many others' similar difficulties, still I feel afraid whenever a newt dies that I could have done something more - even when I am doing everything the literature tells me is okay.

 

[Otterwoman]

NOw here we are talking viridescens. Aren't other subspecies easier to raise? meridonalis, and dorsalis?

 

[Willlis]

I've never cared for n. viridescens long term but I have for n. striatus. They were pretty fool proof easy. I find it surprising that such a closely related species could be that much more difficult. They(n. striatus) seemed to do quite well without a land stage and even with one fruit flies, flour beetles, soda lids with black worms, and pin head crickets seemed to all be taken with relative ease. Has anyone raised striatus and viridescens and can tell me if they noticed a difference?

 

[Sawyer]

NOw here we are talking viridescens. Aren't other subspecies easier to raise? meridonalis, and dorsalis?

There was an add in the classifieds offering to give away N.v.d eggs but only to experienced keepers because they are a more difficult species. Jennewt had mentioned that she had some success and failures and they are indeed a finicky breed, therefore it prompted my curiosity into knowing what makes them a difficult breed.

 

[slowfoot]

Personally, I find my dorsalis easy to raise, but that's only after a few years of trying and with lots of failure at first.

I've had the worst results trying to raise the larvae in small containers with frequent water changes and baby brine shrimp. And the best results when I raised them in a tub of pond water on my front porch in Florida and fed them pond creatures, then chopped, frozen bloodworms.

I'm not very methodical or careful with my note keeping, but I don't really recall any massive die-offs that weren't directly my fault. Before I knew what I was doing with the efts, I would lose everyone at the eft stage. But now I almost never lose large larvae or efts, except when I do something stupid like leave a lid off.

 

[Sawyer]

Personally, I find my dorsalis easy to raise, but that's only after a few years of trying and with lots of failure at first.

I've had the worst results trying to raise the larvae in small containers with frequent water changes and baby brine shrimp. And the best results when I raised them in a tub of pond water on my front porch in Florida and fed them pond creatures, then chopped, frozen bloodworms.

I'm not very methodical or careful with my note keeping, but I don't really recall any massive die-offs that weren't directly my fault. Before I knew what I was doing with the efts, I would lose everyone at the eft stage. But now I almost never lose large larvae or efts, except when I do something stupid like leave a lid off.

Thanks for sharing.

And yes...... Leaving lids off can definitely lose them quickly. When I was in Iraq my wife left the lid off of my N. kaiseri tank and they all got out. Luckily she was able to recover 3 of the original 4 adults. I may have been thousands of miles away but I was still devastated.

 

[Otterwoman]

Well, I am the one that will be giving it a shot. I think the larvae part will be OK, I use the pond water method and I've raised noto. vir. in the past, it's the eft stage. But I hope I will get your tips, Slowfoot, and I've been having success this year with what I'll call the leaf method (with T. verr) ! Some dirt subsrate, and then a layer of leaves that I keep adding to, and I spray it twice a day. In among the leaves are whiteworms and springtails, so they can hunt them easily.

 

[Willlis]

the leaf method (with T. verr) ! Some dirt subsrate, and then a layer of leaves that I keep adding to, and I spray it twice a day. In among the leaves are whiteworms and springtails, so they can hunt them easily.

I'll second that method. I think it works great for tiny amphibians!

 

[Sawyer]

Well, I am the one that will be giving it a shot. I think the larvae part will be OK, I use the pond water method and I've raised noto. vir. in the past, it's the eft stage. But I hope I will get your tips, Slowfoot, and I've been having success this year with what I'll call the leaf method (with T. verr) ! Some dirt subsrate, and then a layer of leaves that I keep adding to, and I spray it twice a day. In among the leaves are whiteworms and springtails, so they can hunt them easily.

The leaf method is basically how I am raising a couple species of my juveniles based on advice from the people I bought from. Seems to be working well thus far.

 

[jaster]

I'm in line for some as well, and that method was exactly what I thought to get through the eft stage. I havent raised any Notophthalmus yet so this is my first go, but I feel confident about it. I have always raised pond type larvae in a pond water, no change setup and have had great results. Can't wait for a chance at these guys.

 

[onetwentysix]

I've had success using a clay substrate I make for dart frogs; you can find the recipe and instructions here ( Clay Substrate How-To - Dendroboard ). Basically, it amounts to taking a mix of redart clay and passing it through a quarter inch screen, and then baking for quite a while. You don't need the fancy ingredients in that recipe, but they don't hurt, they're just expensive.

The idea is that it creates a lot of surface area for the springtails to hide without being eaten by the animals; this means they don't tend to get wiped out, and you can end up with much larger populations of springtails in setups with that. Cover the clay with leaves (lots of them) and you can make baiting stations if you like, using anything from mushrooms to fruit to fish flakes, and the springs will come up to eat it, etc. Then, you just need to get them to the point where they can take fruit flies, and after that it's a piece of cake; sometimes they'll morph out large enough for flies, especially stunted flies, and that's even easier, but springtails are always great to have in an eft tank.

 

[slowfoot]

I used to use the leaf litter method, but I never had much success with it. Now I hand-feed each eft from the time they morph. I don't think I've lost a single eft this way, except to the above-mentioned stupid mistakes.

 

[Wildebeestking]

All of my N. viridescens efts are kept in a rubbermaid filled with dirt, dead leaves, and a bit of grass. I have a breeding population of isopods that I occasionally put some in as food, but most of the time I just fill a little plastic dish in the tank with bloodworms and they all come out and have their share. So far it has worked well and I've gotten two to successfully morph into adults.

 

[Otterwoman]

Slowfoot tell me more about how you hand feed them. What do you offer such tiny little creatures, and with what, tongs?

 

[slowfoot]

I use cut up pieces of teeny-tiny earthworms (I always have a supply of these because the larvae always morph in spring/summer). I've also used cut up blackworms and termites with squished heads. I start out by just placing a tiny worm bit (they just have to move a tiny bit) in front of each eft and then replacing whatever cover that eft was under. I use forceps because the pieces are so small. Then I just check back in a minute or two and see who's eating.

It sounds very tedious - and it is, if I have more than 20 efts - but I've gotten everyone to start eating this way. Some don't need any help, and some need a lot of prompting to start eating after morphing - weeks of trying. Eventually, I can just wiggle the food in front of them and they grab it. Or they come out to beg when I open the lid.

I'm not saying the leaf litter/free range method doesn't work, but my experience has been mostly putting 30 efts in a box with a lot of food and getting 10 or so big efts out at the end, with the rest disappearing along the way. I just don't lose any at all when I hand feed and keep track of who's eating.