Illness/Sickness: Sudden bumps/ Skin Peeling

[MoxieVonMonster]

Hello everybody, First post of course has to be because they are possibly ill.
Lurker for awhile!

Some background details:
I have two white leucistic axies (Rose and Pearl) who are approx. 4 inches and 5-7 months old.
Both housed in a 10 gal until I can get a larger tank
Temp has been sitting between 65-68 during the wisconsin winter/spring. I had a sudden spike yesterday (Sunday 5/17) where it went up to 73 (F not C) Managed to get it down to 70.
Had a few feeder minnows in the tank last week, and I forgot to do a water change.
Fish were fed to my axies and I did a water change once I remembered. (<_> Long week at work) I want to say it was a day or so before I noticed the bumps all over them, and I immediately rushed to this forum to see if there were any illness topics on the subject.
They eat just fine. Diet consists of: Carnivore pellets/ Rosey Minnows/Live blackworms in order of most eaten to least. They refuse earthworms right now.

I read a few threads and decided to do another water change and steep a teabag in their tank (Cooled tea with dechlorinated water) I let them sit in a tea infused tank overnight and then did another water change the next afternoon. (Then registered an account on here) They seem to be looking better, but when I got home from work tonight I noticed that one of my axies' tail looked like it was peeling. This is the only spot that I noticed and didn't see it on the other lotl

I don't currently know the stats on my water, but quick question on that (If I take a sample but I have to wait until after work to take it to the pet store, would the readings be affected by sitting in my car for 9 hours?)
Lesson learned though, will be buying a good testing kit tomorrow night

Picture time:
This was 3 weeks ago (4/26): http://i.imgur.com/NPuVAdF.jpg http://i.imgur.com/hd0eirt.jpg
This was Saturday (5/16): http://i.imgur.com/fKoE3gB.jpg (Ignore the water spots) You can kinda see the pimple like protrusions on their chin and legs
Here is a close up of a tail: http://i.imgur.com/lSJQYdB.jpg
The tea was already in the water by that point, so the water looks a bit tan.
One thing I noticed is that their eyes were sunken in and/or their faces were puffy or covered like a cataract because their eyes didn't shine gold when a light was passed over them like it normally does. They are both affected by the pimples, but only one has skin flakes I don't have any pictures of the skin peeling as i found out about that tonight and it's already too dark in my room to obtain a photo

Anybody know whats up?
Up until I had a lapse in doing the water change, I was changing their water weekly (Every sunday) I try to spot clean their tank as often as I can, and I usually handfeed them pellets and fish. I didn't feed the fish in the tank any fish food, but I won't be putting fish in the tank again. My axie liked to 'hunt' and it was pretty great entertainment

Long post is long
tl:dr Axie has pimples/ flaking skin. Frequent water changes but missed. Don't currently know levels.

Thanks guys!

 

[allied123]

How long has the tank been up and running? is it cycled? the levels are really important to know. Usually they're used to tell how much water needs to be changed during cycling and thereafter to decide how much water needs to be changed until you really know your cycle. If you're planning on getting a testing kit tomorrow then there's really no point in taking it to be tested (from what I understand they usually test with test strips which are notoriously inaccurate), just test the tank water when you get home with the kit. I'm not really sure what to say about the bumps or peeling...it could be due to the heat or ammonia poisoning (or some axies, as they get bigger/older get bumpier skin I've noticed), either way the best thing would probably just be to keep the water cool and clean, hopefully someone more experienced can give you better advice.

 

[MoxieVonMonster]

The tank has been running for 3 months. It was running for a month before I put the pair in
I was using test strips for awhile, but because I knew them to be inaccurate, I was doing 20% water changed weekly. Test strips were giving me good readings, but I was trying to be careful.
I was just curious if water sitting in my car would affect the readings at all, and it was a slightly irrelevant question.

 

[qannp]

Maybe it's because I haven't finished my first coffee yet, but all I can see are iridophores?

 

[qannp]

Good morning again, I stared at the pictures for the last five minutes and still don't see anything…but I'll try to give some feedback.

- 10 gallons is awfully small. Please try to find a larger tank as soon as possible. It will also be easier to keep good water quality in a larger tank.

- It's good that you managed to lower the temperature. 70F is ok, if you could reduce it a little more would be better. I try to keep my tank at 64F. A large tank will be easier to keep cool, too!

- Water changes have to become routine. When my four axies were the size of yours, they were under quarantine in a 16 gallon tank, and I did 80% to 100% water changes daily for four weeks.

- Since I own a testing kid, I don't know if the water is affected if it sits in your car for hours, sorry…choose a liquid testing kit, they're way more accurate than the stripes.

- Extra credits for adding tl:dr.

Try to do more water changes and keep the water cool. In most cases, this is enough to help them.

When I'm afraid that my axies are sick (and I tend to worry a lot), I go through this checklist:

- Are the gills curled (pointing forward)? (If yes: Reduce stress factors like current, high temperature…)

- Are the gills in unusual condition, like clotted or reduced frills? (If yes: Do water changes immediately, check water parameters)

- Is the tail curled? (If yes: See the above.)

- Are there signs of fungus (looks like little cotton balls)? (If yes: Saltbaths, quarantine, water changes)

- How do the droppings look like, do they look unusual? (If slimy: Could be parasites or bacterial infection. Vet needed.)

- Does it bleed? (If yes: Where does the blood come from? Has it been bitten? -> quarantine, cool water, maybe tea. Bleeding from the gills, no cause visible? -> To the vets. NOW.)

- Is it bloated? (If yes: The vets.)

tl;dnr: Do more water changes, keep them in cool, fresh water, if it gets worse, ask for further advice.

 

[MoxieVonMonster]

They have a 40 gallon on the way! They were about 2 inches when I put them into the 10 gal, and I figured I had a few months before they got big enough to need more space. I was very wrong

As far as seeing anything, the white flecks in the tail are not under the skin. I guess the best way I can accurately describe their body pimples is being very toad like. They're raised and bumpy. While my lotl do have iridophores, its mostly concentrated on their bellies. This bumpy appearance concerns me because it was just so sudden.

Since I handfeed them, I also go through a pretty similar checklist since I'm a first time axolotl owner, anything unusual has me browsing this site for awhile. I use tongs or my baster when I 'handfeed' them in case I have anything bad on my hands since I work with chemicals at my job Thank you for your response!

 

[qannp]

Parasites could cause skin irritations, too. Do they try to scratch the bumpy spots, like a dog with their hindlegs or are they showing any other unusual behaviour?

Try to keep cool and keep monitoring them, and please tell us if you notice something. :happy:

 

[MoxieVonMonster]

Updating for future references for myself and others who might have a similar issue:
My tank stats are ok.
Ammonia is 0
Nitrate was 0
Nitrite was 0

5/19
Ended up giving them a 15 minute salt bath with new water and the dechlorinator I was using. I've been using Jungle Start Right. Active Ingredients are sodium Chloride, Aloe Vera and polyvinylpyrolidone. For Chlorine and Chloramine.

I found another thread that described the same spots I was having, or it seemed since I was on mobile and tiny pictures are tiny. His ammonia was very high, and because I forgot to do a water change last week, it might be ammonia. It may be allergens to whatever is in my dechlorinator and its possible I was using too much/too less/too frequent. Or maybe parasites. Thread link: http://www.caudata.org/forum/f46-be...canum/f58-sick-axolotl/99397-white-spots.html

5/20
I picked up Seachem's Prime after work (Strongly recommended by multiple threads), and I'll be giving them another salt bath using this dechlorinator instead to test the allergy hypothesis. While their main tank is still using the Jungle brand, my next water change will be using Prime.
They seem to look better tonight since the salt bath from the previous night
I'm still using a salt bath in case this is fungus/parasite related. Low dose 2 1/2 tablespoons in a gallon tub for 15 minutes.

 

[ChristineB]

I'm just a noob but I happened to read on another thread that aloe vera can cause irritation for axies. That seems more likely than water test kit malfunction. Hope the new product helps them!

 

[MoxieVonMonster]

Re: Sudden bumps/ Skin Peeling (Possible Resolve!)

Update!

Hey everybody! I wanted to update you on my babies condition.
I changed the water conditioner to Seachem's Prime and did a 60% water change the other day to help rid the tank of the Start Right.
Today most of their skin is clear. There is still quite a few raised bumps, but they don't look like the swollen pimply monsters from a week ago. I only did two salt baths but have kept some mind tannis in the water.

I'm going to go with it was a possible allergic reaction to the Start right / Aloe Vera.
I had been using that water conditioner since day one, but it could've been an overexposure type allergen!

So recap/ tldr:
*Both of my axies developed pimple like skin, looked a bit swollen and had some peeling skin. The best indicator was their tail was really 'cloudy' looking with spots. Forgot to do a water change, thought it was ammonia related.
.
Treatment Used:
Started with a tea bath for 24 hours, Water change every day 20%
Salt bath to rule out possible parasite/fungus
Changed water conditioner from Start Right to Seachem's Prime
2nd salt bath with new conditioner
Massive water change with new conditioner

They look better now, pimples are fading fast. Tails are 'clear' again. No confirmed cause of symptoms, but points to possible allergen. If the pimples make a come back, I'll update~