achaochun3
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Hi just part of my collection =]

You could you tell me what types they are please .
i would compare to keeping crested,palmate and smooth together
T. cf. kweichowensis (1 individual)
T. kweichowensis (1 individual)
T. shanjing (3 individuals)
T. wenxianensis(1 individual)
T. taliangensis (1 individual)
Cheers,
Hi just part of my collection =]
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There have been some CB T.verrucosus, and a limited number of WC T.taliangensis, T.shanjing, T.verrucosus, but few people have had retail access to the these. T.cf.kweichowensis has been distributed wholesale and retail by the hundreds or thousands.
QUOTE]
Not true for the UK, there seems to be a continual steady flow of those species in the UK at the moment, especially a large number of T.verrucosus and T.shanjing have been bred lately.
Rodrigo's synopsis is accurate.
The comparison with T.shanjing is only half-accurate. Orange head, legs, tail, warts, and dorsal stripe is T.shanjing, regardless of shade or background color. The species is known to vary across its range, and its range extends into Thailand, probably through Myanmar and Laos. Similar animals with black limbs are isolated in northeastern Thailand and likely Laos, and are likely a new species. I refer to these as T.cf.shanjing
T.verrucosus is brown. End of story. T.verrucosus does not occur in Thailand, nor anywhere else east of Myanmar and Yunnan - specimens with orange are T.shanjing, not T.verrucosus. "Shanjing-like verrucosus" are T.shanjing.
.Frog eyes you seem to know your stuff and i enjoy reading your informative reports on Tylototriton ,although I'm slightly confused as in Caudata culture there seems to be a care sheet on Tylototriton verrucoses and an article on Tylototriton verrucose occuring in Chang mai ,Thailand.
This article makes me slightly sceptical on your hypothesis ,I'm sorry but I believe Shanjing and Verrucoses and all other Tylototriton Information seems to be limited or at least underfunded and incorrect,look at pictures of wenxianensis and asperimus can anyone tell the difference?
Our asperimus specimens have only been diagnosed as of aquiring 3 wenxianensis,so where and who has the relevant information?
Or is most of the information or photographs of wrong accounts?
I believe there is'nt a straight forward answer untill more study is done and all this c.f kweichow or c.f anything is a variational or regional difference
I would welcome more comments/criticism and information as there doesnt seem to be enough...Unless there's a book or two i've over looked?
regards
Those papers are wrong. Many Asian researchers have been slow to accept the existence of T.shanjing as a species distinct from T.verrucosus, and have thus treated them all as T.verrucosus still. Thai researchers call Thai animals T.verrucosus, even though two species are in Thailand, one matching the original description of T.shanjing, and neither matching the revised description of T.verrucosus. T.shanjing, T.cf.shanjing, and T.verrucosus are divided east-west by mountain ranges. Populations in Yunnan, eastern Myanmar, and Thailand are connected by valleys. It's not logical to expect T.verrucosus to cross mountain ridges while T.shanjing miraculously avoids following a valley southward just because there's a border in the way..Frog eyes you seem to know your stuff and i enjoy reading your informative reports on Tylototriton ,although I'm slightly confused as in Caudata culture there seems to be a care sheet on Tylototriton verrucoses and an article on Tylototriton verrucose occuring in Chang mai ,Thailand.
In the description of T.shanjing, the authors specifically limited T.shanjing to China and refered all non-Chinese animals to T.verrucosus. They had no reason to do so, apart from maybe a lack of specimens from south or east of Yunnan [in which case they stuck with the status quo for those countries, which was "verrucosus".
If you look at pictures or descriptions from Darjeeling, Nepal, or the paper describing T.shanjing, all specimens of T.verrucosus are solid brown, and other research shows that these animals are genetically closest relatives. One website in Thailand [a tourism site for Chiang Mai] is finally calling local animals T.shanjing, the only species whose description they match.
Not correct. I have provided links to many papers which are available for no charge. There is extensive genetic and morphological data for Tylototriton, though still much work to do. Refer to the taxonomy threads to find the relevant research. It's the hobby which is incorrect. The science is fairly up to date, and I follow the latter.This article makes me slightly sceptical on your hypothesis ,I'm sorry but I believe Shanjing and Verrucoses and all other Tylototriton Information seems to be limited or at least underfunded and incorrect,
look at pictures of wenxianensis and asperimus can anyone tell the difference?I have specifically avoided dealing with Yaotriton here. One recent paper resolved the problems of identification by lumping most populations into one of two named species and a third unnamed one which is physically identical to T.asperrimus.Our asperimus specimens have only been diagnosed as of aquiring 3 wenxianensis,so where and who has the relevant information?
Or is most of the information or photographs of wrong accounts?
However, more extensive data are available which show that despite the lack of physical differences, there are a fair number of undescribed species masquerading as T.wenxianensis, T.hainanensis, and T.asperrimus. These species are as different from one another as those of subgenus Tylototriton...it's just that we can't tell by looking at them.
Bottom line - don't trust current identifications or identification methods. Without locality information, an animal that looks like T.notialis could be topotypic T.asperrimus, and an animal that looks like stereotypical T.asperrimus might be an undescribed relative of T.wenxianensis.
That's more or less the case, although the studies have largely already been done. What is lacking is descriptions which allow differentiation of all the unnamed species from the old concepts of named ones.I believe there is'nt a straight forward answer untill more study is done
That's just not the case. That kind of regional variation very rarely occurs within a single species. When organisms from one region look consistantly different from their relatives in another region, it's usually because they are distinct species which have not interbred freely in millions of years. In subgenus Tylototriton, apart from the possibility of more than one brown species, all known forms are geographically and morphologically distinct. Including brown ones, I count seven.and all this c.f kweichow or c.f anything is a variational or regional difference
I would welcome more comments/criticism and information as there doesnt seem to be enough...Unless there's a book or two i've over looked?See the papers and associated comments in the taxonomy threads, and review the original description of T.shanjing. I believe I also posted a couple of papers in this section, regarding geographically distinct Thai animals.regards